Let's play a bunch of Pit Hacks

[morsel/morceau]

Play something you don't have to edit in lunar magic first.

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Play something you don't have to edit in lunar magic first.

Here's the problem:

kaizo hacks have gone in a direction where there is no longer a middle ground difficulty-wise. Everything is essentially made only for TASers, so no one ever considers important design decisions such as weather an obstacle requires clairvoyance to beat (or even weather or not an obstacle is even FUN). As it is it's almost impossible for me to find hacks that are remotely close to the range of difficulty I want, so given the few options I have sometimes I have to make edits.

No one ever tests their kaizo hacks without savestates anymore, and that makes me sad. I'm kind of left in a situation where the games I want to play don't really exist. Therefore I have to work with what I've got and tweak things around. If you have a problem with that, I welcome you to play these hacks savestateless yourself and record it for us all. If you cant/aren't interested in doing that, well, sorry but I can't help you

[peteyboo]

Hyper 6 Bowser in the Dark Abyss

o_o

No honestly. The second half is insane. And I'm not even done the relatively tame first half. And you know how hard the second half must be if I'm calling the first half "relatively tame".

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Try visiting the Kaizo hack forum on SMWCentral before you generalise about modern Kaizo hackers.

I've lurked there literally every day since the forums conception. Dude, I started the first kaizo collaboration there and was a huge proponent in getting that forum made in the first place.

Even the most highly praised neo-kaizo hacks fit my description pretty well. That includes Hertz Donut, World of Pain, etc.

There are exceptions (I listed the ones I know of), but even then I really don't think anything made in the springboard difficulty range has been created with non-tool using players in mind. *stands up on pedestal; flag waving in background* people, test your kaizo hacks with slowdown but do not use savestates! That way you can compensate for any skill level of player reaction time without loosing sight of your levels pacing and fun!

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Speaking of which...

Episode 3: The Opposite of Climax
Wherein I beat the level
By which I mean the game
And follow up with bad post-production

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Do Hertz Donut.

I know it's hard to tell when you aren't playing w/o savestates (I'm assuming your used them on it), but Hertz Donut is significantly harder than the hacks I listed above. It's not the main obstacles that are the problem. It's the lengths of the levels and the culmination of precision, transition-obstacle jumps. The level nickel-and-dimes you so many times that you never get the chance to actually do the main challenges that are presented to you.

It's an amazing hack, as are many of the newer kaizos; It's just very close to unplayable.

[anonymousbl00dlust]

these
are
levels
I'm
considering

pick one.

[Wyatt]

That hornet one looks pretty cool! Shame there are a few annoying one-frame jumps like the p-switch hop.

The mario in pain world one pisses me off: it seems really fun and is almost ASMT-like in its difficulty at the start, but then it throws in one-frame jumps like crazy, almost as a blatant fuck-you to the savestateless crowd. And don't get me started on the no-midpoint problem the last two have.

Also, my own suggestion: race me in cool or cruel!

[anonymousbl00dlust]

That hornet one looks pretty cool! Shame there are a few annoying one-frame jumps like the p-switch hop.

The mario in pain world one pisses me off: it seems really fun and is almost ASMT-like in its difficulty at the start, but then it throws in one-frame jumps like crazy, almost as a blatant fuck-you to the savestateless crowd. And don't get me started on the no-midpoint problem the last two have.

Also, my own suggestion: race me in cool or cruel!

The hornet level was my first choice as well. It's actually from Mario in Pain world too.

The 2nd to last one doesnt need a midpoint imo. Maybe a bit long (If I designed it I would have taken out an obstacle) but not too bad. As for YAMW, its main problem is actually that the physics are messed up - the player falls faster than normal, which doesn't bode well when you've managed to commit every possible normal falling speed to memory. If YAMW didn't have that problem I'd LP the whole game

Racing you in C|C sounds fun (assuming we're using tools)! I think I'll take you up on that offer once I've had some more experience behind the microphone.

[Marcaek]

Man, I'm getting a real Hyper 6 feel from Hornet Hole. MiP seems like it's just a BIT too unfair for a toolless run but that's just me.

[Wyatt]

By "race" I actually meant we both try and finish it on our own time (toolless), and see who finishes first. I hadn't considered a full-on active race, mainly because I also have little experience with commentating, but if you wanted to do that some time (with tools) I'd give it a shot :)

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Wyatt's C|C video was toolless.

yes, but a race implies someone reaches the goal, and C|C is a big game.

By "race" I actually meant we both try and finish it on our own time (toolless), and see who finishes first.

oh. well I'm honestly not sure then. I'm not a big fan of (playing) puzzle obstacles and that's like 90% of what C|C is.

[AUS]

Play toolless with 90% slowdown race.

[anonymousbl00dlust]

next hack is called shells. after that is springboard challenge, hot foot hop, or level 2 of quest for the rainbow treasure. There is also a fun level from a (not very good) hack called yosumikalo 2 that I would like to try.

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Episode 4: A step backward
Wherein I play springboards and shells
Except the springboards are missing
And the level design is kind of eh

[anonymousbl00dlust]

[6:45:53 PM] Panga: kinda wish anonymousbl00dlust didnt actually change part of level 1 of SASH, and actually did Shells savestateless.

I PMed him asking him if it was okay but he never responded! If it bothers him that much I'll do the easy version again because the thing I put there was way harder.

EDIT: I just heard from him and not only did he say that he didn't care but that he agreed about the difficulty. So uh, conflict resolved I guess.

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Here's the deal:

I started working on a limited-savestate playthrough of pit of despair. As it is, I've only made it to the first pixel-perfect drop through that chasm of munchers (which for a savestateless run I sill think is pretty good). I think that outside of the extreme pixel perfect parts I could pull this off with 20-30 savestates, but that would require me modifying out said parts.

Some people seemed to have a problem with SASH being modified, which I understand, but there is no way I am going to keep playing this one unless certain things get cut out. I'm doing it either way for fun and if people have a problem with it then I just won't record the play-through.

So to peeps who enjoy watching my videos please choose one of the following:

• an easy kaizo rom played blind and w/o any modifications
  pit of despair with all the obstacles still in tact but toned down slightly.

[AUS]

Eh, I don't think changing pixel-perfect things to be non pixel-perfect is a "slight" edit. That sounds pretty big to me.

Example of a slight edit: Changing the munchers into teleport blocks that don't kill you, but make you restart the challenge.

That's very slight, wouldn't you agree?

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Its still a series of shell jumps, midair L/R scrolls, keyjumps, and general insanity without a single floor tile to stand on. Screw it then. If you don't want to watch me do it I won't record it.

[AUS]

I mean, the change I'm suggesting is basically identical to a savestate, so it's not like it was a great idea.

[limepie20]

I think it's fine. If you are doing something that isn't enjoyable, make it into something that will be enjoyable.

[anonymousbl00dlust]

Episode 5: Harder Than It Looks
Wherein I press L and R repetedly
And suffer extreme frustration
By the hands of a ill-considered glitch

I'm starting to worry that commentary may get repetitive in these videos. It's very hard to take the non-sequitur approach while trying to concentrate on something so difficult, so I always end up kind of saying the same thing. I may end up doing solely post-production commentary or silent playthroughs if enough people agree. Otherwise expect to hear a lot of ranting about level design philosophy and rediculous oppinions about how TASing accidentally ruined kaizo...

[Awakenyourmind]

I'd rather hear random crap then silence. I'm about done with my YI level, and I've made the insane parts optional so you wont have to be silent.

If the levels you are doing are insane, then people should understand commentary may not be pin point and amazing. Look at raocow's when he plays hard crap! And he's a vet. Though there is probably a bunch wrong with that I said, I blame that on it being late.

[DWebb32]

would you consider incomprehensible from World of Pain by Penangbenny?

it's relatively tame and you could savestate every room or so

[DWebb32]

World of Pain is a good deal more challenging than SASH. I wouldn't recommend it.

yeah i know especially the later levels but the first isn't all too bad minus a few parts, and considering he was willing to play pit of dispair, this should be nothing ;)

edit: also, this thread is called let's play a bunch of Pit Hacks, so yeah