The New Nintendo 3DS

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Mineyl
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Mineyl »

Hoeloe wrote:All in all though, Nintendo found flaws with their console and fixed them with a new console, not a peripheral patch. It's exactly what people would expect them to do, the only complaint I can see people making that has any real validity is the name, which perhaps could have been better. I myself was thinking of getting a new 3DS anyway, and now I think I'll hold off for one of these. It's a little annoying, because I already bought a Circle Pad Pro in preparation for Monster Hunter 4, but oh well. Judging from the Japanese info, the price is pretty reasonable, too. Converted, the Japanese price of the XL system is just over £100, and I paid over £200 for my 3DS on release, so it's not even that expensive, for a new system.
Problem is, it's not really a new system. They've made what I've seen referred to elsewhere as a "half-gen step." They upgraded the hardware of the 3DS while not actually making an entirely new system, and they've done it well before anyone would have expected them to. Before, upgrades were almost always cosmetic or ergonomic in nature, but now they've increased the number of sticks and buttons and whatnot and are going to release exclusive games for it, alienating those that already bought earlier versions of the 3DS.

I know it probably seems like an overreaction, and indeed, it's not set in stone that Nintendo and company would only develop for the New 3DS from its release forward; however, one would have to wonder what the point is of upgrading if it doesn't have enough of an exclusive library, hence why I brought it up. I'm really only concerned because the 3DS is currently the thing keeping them afloat, and one of the last things they need to be doing is rendering their old hardware useless when they've got such an expansive consumer base for it already (and again, well before anyone expected the 3DS to be replaced/obsoleted).

Realistically, though, the TRUE successor of the 3DS, whatever they decide to call it, will be backwards-compatible with both 3DS and N3DS titles alike, so it's not like consumers who realize this are obligated to actually buy the N3DS in the event that it does gain an expansive library of exclusives. However, as I said before, this simply damages my trust in Nintendo and my faith that being any sort of an early adopter of their hardware is a good decision.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Sorel »

Why Nintendo

Why did you kill my wallet
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

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Fluffi-dono wrote:Why Nintendo

Why did you kill my wallet
For business. In business you can either expand your market or draw more revenue from your existing one. It's fair to assume from Miyamoto's recent interview in Edge that they have abandoned expanding the market and so must draw more revenue from their current market. However, they should look at Apple, and see that too many incremental revisions shrinks your market share, and look further back at Sega, and see that rapidly obsoleting consoles really shrinks your market share.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

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Doctor Shemp wrote:
Fluffi-dono wrote:Why Nintendo

Why did you kill my wallet
For business. In business you can either expand your market or draw more revenue from your existing one. It's fair to assume from Miyamoto's recent interview in Edge that they have abandoned expanding the market and so must draw more revenue from their current market. However, they should look at Apple, and see that too many incremental revisions shrinks your market share, and look further back at Sega, and see that rapidly obsoleting consoles really shrinks your market share.
Actually that was a rethorical question. A joke.

But whatever, it doesnt really matter.

I can't really recall how many consoles Sega released, but quite a lot. I guess about 25 in just 15 years?

About apple, yeah, it sure is annoying to be a new version every 2 or 3 years but most of the time you only need to "upgrade" 2 revisions (e.g. From iphone/pod 2 to iphone/pod 4) because otherwise you have to pay a lot of money for little features.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Doctor Shemp »

The Sega period I was referring to was the mid to late 90s. I mean look at how ridiculously short lifetimes some of these had (I'm using North American dates):
Sega CD: 1992 - 1996 (4 years)
32X: 1994 - 1996 (2 years)
Nomad: 1995 - 1996 (1 year)
Saturn: 1995 - 1998 (3 years)

No wonder when the Dreamcast came out quite a few people weren't prepared to risk getting it and having it be obsoleted soon after.

I'm not saying Nintendo's on that track now. It's just something to consider.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Torchkas »

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo's console line would die the same way Sega's did.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Hoeloe »

Mineyl wrote: Problem is, it's not really a new system. They've made what I've seen referred to elsewhere as a "half-gen step." They upgraded the hardware of the 3DS while not actually making an entirely new system, and they've done it well before anyone would have expected them to. Before, upgrades were almost always cosmetic or ergonomic in nature, but now they've increased the number of sticks and buttons and whatnot and are going to release exclusive games for it, alienating those that already bought earlier versions of the 3DS.
I don't see the difference. It has the same name, but upgraded hardware and a different button layout. You could say the same of the the DS and 3DS. The 3DS was a DS with a faster processor, an analogue stick and a 3D wide screen. The only real difference is that ghe 3DS had new software compared to the DS, while the new 3DS doesn't. It is, however, a new system with its own range of games, as different as the Gameboy and Gameboy Colour. I don't really understand why this is different from a completely new console.

Also, the Wii U is selling better than the XBox One, and the 3DS is the current best selling handheld and is up at top of all console sales. Nintendos consoles aren't going anywhere.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Mineyl »

Hoeloe wrote:I don't see the difference. It has the same name, but upgraded hardware and a different button layout. You could say the same of the the DS and 3DS. The 3DS was a DS with a faster processor, an analogue stick and a 3D wide screen. The only real difference is that ghe 3DS had new software compared to the DS, while the new 3DS doesn't. It is, however, a new system with its own range of games, as different as the Gameboy and Gameboy Colour. I don't really understand why this is different from a completely new console.
Again, they're doing all this before anyone expected them to, and it's different from a new console generation because the upgrades aren't anywhere extensive enough for it to be considered a separate piece of hardware from the 3DS that can stand on its own for half a decade. There is a MASSIVE difference between the DS and 3DS while the difference between the 3DS and N3DS is miniscule: it's only big enough to release exclusive games for the technically-better system.

The only reason I'm even raising a fuss about it is because a video game system is expected to last a certain minimum amount of time (five years being the go-to figure). It's been less than four years since the original 3DS hit the market. If Nintendo is going to cycle out their older hardware so rapidly, then I'm less likely to want to buy into a console knowing that it will have such limited support.

By the way, I don't think Nintendo is in any actual danger, I just don't want to see them bleed their money away needlessly. I love Nintendo products.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Clamestarebla »

Who's happy he didn't buy a 3DS yet? This guy.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

Post by Doctor Shemp »

In regards to how fast they're introducing new consoles, it will be interesting to see how long the Wii U lasts. The Wii lasted 7 years (2006-2013) but Nintendo only really supported it for about 5. The Wii U came out in 2012, but the only Wii games Nintendo released in 2011 were Skyward Sword & Wii Play Motion, neither of which were big sellers, and Skyward Sword was meant to come out earlier anyway and only came out in 2011 because of development delays. Five years' support isn't too short, but it's not exactly long either.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

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Doctor Shemp wrote:In regards to how fast they're introducing new consoles, it will be interesting to see how long the Wii U lasts. The Wii lasted 7 years (2006-2013) but Nintendo only really supported it for about 5. The Wii U came out in 2012, but the only Wii games Nintendo released in 2011 were Skyward Sword & Wii Play Motion, neither of which were big sellers, and Skyward Sword was meant to come out earlier anyway and only came out in 2011 because of development delays. Five years' support isn't too short, but it's not exactly long either.
They also had Kirby's Return to Dream Land that year, but they're usually good for four years on a system and just sort of do whatever on the fifth.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

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Bean wrote:
Doctor Shemp wrote:In regards to how fast they're introducing new consoles, it will be interesting to see how long the Wii U lasts. The Wii lasted 7 years (2006-2013) but Nintendo only really supported it for about 5. The Wii U came out in 2012, but the only Wii games Nintendo released in 2011 were Skyward Sword & Wii Play Motion, neither of which were big sellers, and Skyward Sword was meant to come out earlier anyway and only came out in 2011 because of development delays. Five years' support isn't too short, but it's not exactly long either.
They also had Kirby's Return to Dream Land that year, but they're usually good for four years on a system and just sort of do whatever on the fifth.
Dammit Wikipedia you failed me! I don't think it's true about your 5 year theory though. I'll have a look. I'm counting here first- and second-party games, since Return to Dream Land, which you mentioned, is second-party (HAL Lab), and excluding ones that were essentially second-party shovelware. I'm also just doing it for home consoles since everyone knows the Game Boy and GBA had long support and I'm using US release dates.

NES
5th year (1989): Cobra Triangle, Dragon Warrior, Faxanadu, Tetris
6th year (1990): Dr. Mario, Final Fantasy, NES Play Action Football, Snake Rattle 'n' Roll, StarTropics, Super Mario Bros. 3
7th year (1991): NES Open Tournament Golf
8th year (1992): Yoshi
9th year (1993): Kirby's Adventure, Tetris 2, Yoshi's Cookie
10th year (1994): Wario's Woods, Zoda's Revenge: StarTropics II

That's solid support for a long time. Look at SMB3 in the 6th year for example or Tetris in the 5th year.

SNES
5th year (1995): Donkey Kong Country 2, EarthBound, Killer Instinct, Kirby's Avalanche, Kirby's Dream Course, Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island
6th year (1996): Donkey Kong Country 3, Kirby Super Star, Street Fighter Alpha 2, Super Mario RPG, Terranigma, Tetris Attack
7th year (1997): Arkanoid: Doh it Again, Kirby's Dream Land 3, Space Invaders

Not as long as the NES, but still 6 years of solid support and a good 7th year.

Nintendo 64
5th year (2000): Banjo-Tooie, Excitebike 64, Kirby 64: The Crystal Shards, The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, Mario Party 3, Mario Tennis, Paper Mario, Pokemon Puzzle League, Pokemon Stadium 2, Ridge Racer 64, StarCraft 64
6th year (2001): Dr. Mario 64

Ok, that's true on stopping after the fifth year, but the Wii was a lot more successful than the N64 and deserving of more.

Gamecube
5th year (2005): Battalion Wars, DDR Mario Mix, Donkey Kong Jungle Beat, Donkey Konga 2, Donkey Konga 3, Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance, Geist, Mario Party 7, Mario Superstar Baseball, Pokemon XD: Gale of Darkness, Star Fox: Assault, Super Mario Strikers
6th year (2006): Chibi-Robo!, Baten Kaitos Origins, The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess, Odama

That one I'd agree with you on.

Still, considering that the Wii was the most successful home Nintendo console ever, you'd expect it to get lengthy support in line with the NES or SNES, not medium- to short-length support like the N64 or Gamecube.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

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Doctor Shemp wrote:In regards to how fast they're introducing new consoles, it will be interesting to see how long the Wii U lasts.
I'm hoping it has a decently long life. I personally love the console and want it to last as long as possible to see more awesome games released for it.
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Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

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This is all very confusing.

uhhhhh probably can't say anything that hasn't already been said. But I think the ZL/ZR buttons are in a weird place, at the very least; so, all the shoulder buttons are on your index fingers, rather than the ZL/ZR buttons on the WiiU being placed so that you could easily use your middle fingers instead (with your index fingers on L/R, of course), but the way they're positioned here seem like it would be really easy to accidentally hit one button while you're trying to press another.

Also yeah this seems like a very strange idea to me when the 3DS doesn't feel like it's even been out that long, and especially right after the release of the 2DS... and stuff. But really I see no reason to expect that its lifecycle will be ending in a few years or anything; what would be the point of making a totally-brand-new console/handheld when the existing ones are already plenty good enough? (although there's Sony/Microsoft doing more or less exactly that)
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    Wow, I can't believe that some of the most 'iconic' games (to me at least) came out so 'late' in each system's lifespan?? That's crazy.
    Doctor Shemp wrote:Nomad: 1995 - 1996 (1 year)
    ...I've never even heard of that one, either. Suppose that just exemplifies how little impact it had.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by Ometeotl »

    The Nomad was just a portable Genesis. As in, you literally put Genesis cartridges into it. It failed because the screen was bad, the thing was about as portable as one would expect a device that took cartridges that size, and it ate through about $30 of batteries a day.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by Doctor Shemp »

    Yes, it wasn't exactly a new console as such, but I put it there because it was a waste of Sega's time and money that could have gone elsewhere. It's also stupid because a) it was incompatible with the power base converter, the Sega CD and the Sega 32X, b) it was released half a year after the Saturn and c) the Genesis was discontinued worldwide two years after the Nomad came out anyway, which meant no new Genesis games past that point.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by TheFinalSentinel »

    My 3DS has been a bit on the fritz as of late. Kind of glad I haven't yet given into getting an XL to replace it now.

    Also, Nintendo's consoles aren't going anywhere. There have been calculations that they could last for like 10 years on the money they have. [citation needed]
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by Doctor Shemp »

    10 years isn't that long. It's basically this console cycle and the next, meaning if the next isn't a success, it's time to fold (or at least fold on the home console front - the 3DS is a success, albeit a much smaller success than the DS). Also remember that companies stop making hardware before they go bankrupt, not when they go bankrupt (unless you're Atari). If you wait until you go bankrupt then you can't quit and just make software (e.g. 3DO & Sega), you have to quit completely and be dissolved into pieces and sell your name to someone else (e.g. Atari).
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by Bean »

    Nintendo going bankrupt anytime soon is still pretty silly talk to me, but there is a change in the air. That said, the change also affects Sony and Microsoft as mobile is flat-out cheaper and what kids are playing more of nowadays. Those children will not all move on to new consoles. They'll keep going with the cheaper option.

    Nintendo's basically the last stand in the handheld department, Sony on the console front as the XB1 and Wii U are struggling (Great start for the PS4, but the droughts have a good chance of stalling its success), and third-parties are shifting more and more to mobile in a vain attempt to try and capture a market with more expensive games.

    Bah. It's too late to be writing stuff like this. What I'm saying is, play what you want because it will be around for another generation at the very least. It's at the end of the decade and where the market is that will be which way the needle moves. Hoping for all kinds of gaming to stay around myself. More options available without oversaturation, the better a chance I have of getting games I want to play.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by Leet »

    maaaan i dont care about the ramifications of this all i know is my 3ds' screens aren't in the best condition and this looks neat as heck so there we go!
    Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

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    Doctor Shemp wrote:Still, considering that the Wii was the most successful home Nintendo console ever, you'd expect it to get lengthy support in line with the NES or SNES, not medium- to short-length support like the N64 or Gamecube.
    I didn't see that one. Oops!

    The main problem there was that third-parties wouldn't play ball for the casual audience or would halfheartedly go at it and predictably fail... which is funny since they're now scurrying off to with their mobile efforts to try and catch the audience they could've helped cultivate.

    Nintendo's not immune to criticism here as NoA held out on bringing a few titles out like Xenoblade at that point to completely crush that system's momentum after a slight decline between 2009 and 2010. If it had a solid 2011 and then fizzled out in 2012, I think things would be a little different for the Wii U. It didn't, and Nintendo has struggled for the most part ever since.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by TheFinalSentinel »

    http://markets.ft.com/research/Markets/ ... s=7974:TYO

    I'mma just drop this here.

    Also keep in mind that most of my statements were in reference to pre-MK8, when the Wii U had like no games.

    Hell, thinking back, wasn't everyone (read: mostly the same people as now) saying the exact same things about the Wii? I certainly at least remember everyone in school saying that.

    My point in all this is, I have no doubts that Nintendo will be just fine.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by Mineyl »

    All I remember hearing about the original Wii is that the graphics "don't look much different from Gamecube at all," that "it's basically two Gamecubes strapped together," "waggle," and "Nintendo's forgotten about its hardcore audience with these casual games." People want to see a giant fall when they no longer care for that giant, and they won't use numbers to back themselves up when their peers agree with them.
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by swirlybomb »

    Ometeotl/Shemp wrote:Nomad stuff
    Well, I guess that explains a lot then!


    There really should be no need for another "generation" of consoles, honestly... Isn't our gaming technology already plenty more than adequate? >_>
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    Re: The New Nintendo 3DS

    Post by Ashan »

    Not if the glorious PC gaming master race has anything to say about it.
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