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Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by raocow »

I... an Angel Mode finish might be a good idea. I mean, DIstorted Travesty set out the precedent of a boss being too difficult for me and beating it at a lower difficulty level.

If it's not too much trouble... it might be a good idea, yo

Still playing something else this weekend though!
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Telamon »

We can all just find video of the ending if we want to. My choice would be give it one last shot next week and see if you can do it.

I mentioned WoW raid boss design earlier in this thread, and I was reminded again by raocow's strategy to go all out, damage be damned at the end of some runs. It's like when main tank dies while boss is at 3% and you just try to kill it while it eats your healers.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by alleightbits »

It's official. Majora's spine is the vice president of the Angercow Association.
Right under Suboptimal Goopa.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Red »

QubicTom wrote:Wow, those steam screenshots suggest about 600 deaths is the norm for that boss. raocow, are you willing to double the amount of time you've spent on that boss? If your answer is a resounding no, then move on! (The other patreon games are super good and genuinely fun)
Dunno about that, it took me about 260 tries for this last boss and raocow is in general a better player and platformer than me (I got to this same boss with well over six THOUSAND deaths total!), and judging by this last video I think he's pretty close. Ofc this game is no pain, no gain, so if he decides to continue he can expect to become infuriated again and again
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by S.N.N. »

I kind of feel horrible for even suggesting this, but I kind of want to see him tough it out and keep trying, especially since he gets closer and closer each video. Something about the sheer number of deaths and the amount of time he's spent on it would provide an immense amount of satisfaction for everyone if he pulled through and finished the dude off. I mean, aside from a couple of dumb gimmicks (e.g. the poison), I think the boss is pretty damn fitting for a finale. So many games have lame and/or too easy final bosses, but this one seems to pull no punches and really throw every technique you've learned in the game at you.

..but that being said, I would still totally get it if he just said "fuck it" and walked away at this point.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by GalaxyOfJ »

I hope the finale is titled something appropriate like "olympic champion"
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Grounder »

GalaxyOfJ wrote:I hope the finale is titled something appropriate like "olympic champion"
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by ano0maly »

I don't think you needed to try to have daily updates in the first place. As soon as those worm things appeared the other day and you reacted in despair, it might have been a good idea to stop uploading every day, since a string of video 0's is not fun to edit and not fun to watch. I mean, there are exceptions - when a final boss or something is epic enough to expect in advance 3 or 4 videos/separate runs in a video, to show the learning process - but my opinion of this is that it doesn't look interesting enough for that.

Instead you could just play for however long or short works for you and just have the recording on, in case you have a winning run (and maybe add post-commentary to it if needed). There's enough precedent for doing so; you had introduction videos for Super Marisa World final boss and ex boss and mostly waited for the win to upload the following part.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by FusionWarrior »

I decided to spoiler this after writing it because some people might not want to see vitriol after the stress of today.

Honestly at this point I'm kinda really angry. This boss is pretty crap, like so much of this game so far. It has such great moments but it's like corn in a turd. How does this get a 9/10 on steam? Maybe if it was free sure go ahead, or 99 cents, but at 15 bucks I don't see the value. Not in the current internet age at least. Sure back in the NES days where one game might have to get a kiddo the gap between their birthday and the major religious holiday of their parents choosing, I can be okay with that because that might legitimately be all they have to play for that long. Games have come too far for this to be okay. It's not worth it.

My vote wouldn't even be to beat it on easy. The game doesn't deserve it. I'd rather just watch PPR commentate over someone elses recording (with permission of course) because I don't think the game deserves the dignity.


raocow, in my opinion, you have beaten this game.

The computer simply has cheat codes turned on.

...wow this is completely 180 on how I feel about games... I wasn't even this harsh on Jekyll & Hyde...
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Dark Hunter »

Don't call a game bad just because raocow isn't having fun with it. I don't think that's fair to the game.

Many people enjoy very challenging games. They have fun with them even through the rage. They strive to prove to themselves that they can overcome even the nastiest challenge the game can offer.

Now, I'm certainly not saying that raocow is not a good game player. He has played and completed some extremely difficult titles, and there is no doubt in my mind that he can beat Super Jello and complete this game. However, I think sometimes that he may not enjoy these kinds of games, at least not in the way I mentioned above. They may not be to his taste. Which is just fine: everyone has their own preferences.

I would like to see raocow complete this game, but only if that's what he personally wants to do, and he'll enjoy the sense of triumph. If not, the victory is hollow, and there's no reward for either himself or his fans.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Sebby19 »

I don't know why such a difficult game was voted in on patreon in the first place. We all saw what happened with Valdis Story.

That got me thinking, what other games has Rao left unfinished? Off the top of my head:

-Mari Ari (rage quitted, and deleted on camera)
-Clarence's Big Chance
-Copy Kitty
-that one with the dream world and gravity changes
-Valdis Story

Any other's?
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Whimsical Calamari »

Sebby19 wrote:-Copy Kitty
I'm not sure if that should count as "incomplete". He didn't play all the game modes in Turbo, but he did super clear most of the original, and I believe he at least completed Turbo's Normal Mode.
-that one with the dream world and gravity changes
Hina's Fluffy Dream

Clarence's Big Chance was before my time, but I don't believe I saw raocow leave any games unfinished outside of that last one and Valdis Story.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Dark Hunter »

Re:Copy Kitty, I believe raocow has stated his intention to go back and complete Hard Mode on that game at some later point.

He put it off because, at the time he played through Turbo's normal mode, Hard Mode was about to get a major update with a bunch of new stuff, so Azure (one of Copy Kitty's creators) requested raocow wait until the patch updating all that was out.

That patch is now out (and has been for some time), so it's just a matter of time.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by QubicTom »

Dark Hunter wrote:Re:Copy Kitty, ... Hard Mode was about to get a major update with a bunch of new stuff ... That patch is now out (and has been for some time), so it's just a matter of time.
I've been beta testing the version that will be released onto steam, and although there is still some content to be released to testers, it's hugely upgraded, polished and pretty different (in a very good way) to the main version available publicly right now. I hope raocow waits for the steam version before trying hard mode!

Waiting to see now what the B-side will be this weekend... any guesses out there?
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by WhattayaBrian »

It'll obviously be some long overdue Voxatron.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by sedron »

So, I'm gonna put some thoughts here, since I put a lot of my Patreon votes towards this and people have been weirdly critical of this game from the start.

I don't regret voting for this at all. Yeah, there are rough spots to the game and the LP, but overall I think the game is a lot of fun and the LP has been enjoyable. I've fallen behind raocow in terms of progress over the past couple of weeks due to just not having a whole lot of time to put towards the game, but it's been great learning the game and watching rao learn (or otherwise bash his head into a thing until it works,) as well.

Wings of Vi is NOT perfect, nor does it need to be. It is very, VERY hard, but it advertises itself as such. raocow knew this going in. I don't think he would have included it as a voting option were it not something he felt he could reasonably handle. Being difficult to the point where rao gets angry really shouldn't be considered a bad thing. I do think that this is the upper limit of what rao can handle, coming close to being outside his weight class. He doesn't need to be able to beat it, though. It's not the end of the world if it doesn't happen, and it's not a fault of the game for that being the case either.

This isn't the first time rao's taken on a game that ended up being very challenging, and if he ends up not beating it on Normal mode it won't be the first time he's done so. Distorted Travesty obviously ended on a lower difficulty. I believe he ended up save-state abusing his way through the end of S Mario. Actually, let's look at the description from the end of S Mario real quick.
raocow wrote:Yup.

Playing difficult games 'legimitaly' comes with a price. The price of realising that you will not always win. Modern games are made to be won 100% of the time, but this is not always the case with amateur or indepent game. And, uhm, yes.

I'm sure some peeps will say that I've already done harder, or that I could totally learn this thing, but... I'm just not willing. Some things are not worth it. I pushed myself a lot harder than I thought I could through this game, but a mixture of unpreditacle lengths and difficulties made me unwilling to push it in this thing. I rewinded-scum the level so we could see the traps and whatnot, but essentially I consider the game 'unbeaten'.

Guys, I didn't beat the video game. And that's totally fine.
(Link here if you want it.)

So, yeah.

Like some others, I do absolutely believe raocow can beat Supreme Jeh'Oul. He's made a lot of progress, and at this point he's gotten so close that it'd feel like a real anticlimax if he didn't win on Normal mode. That said, I also do not blame rao if he takes WhattyaBrian's Angelic Mode offer. It's not the end of the world if he doesn't ultimately win. It's just a video game. I certainly can't say rao didn't give it his all, either.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Nathan the Talkmaus »

Dark Hunter wrote:Don't call a game bad just because raocow isn't having fun with it. I don't think that's fair to the game.
Well that's not the only reason. :lol:

It's still better than most of the Touhou levels I've seen in SMBX and SMW at this point, I'll grant. And the visuals are a bit more varied than Soldexus was. And he wound up turning this bland, personality-devoid generic chick into a gray-skinned safety bee with lobster tentacles, a huge thong, and an adorable bunny companion.

If regular Jehoul was the real final boss, that would have been the perfectly relieving anticlimax finish to the game, the "real" difficulty being the boss to immediately precede him.
Dark Hunter wrote:Many people enjoy very challenging games. They have fun with them even through the rage. They strive to prove to themselves that they can overcome even the nastiest challenge the game can offer.
raocow is clearly one of them, given some of the games we've seen him beat and what (few) games have beaten him.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Solaris »

i agree with sedron and while my opinion of the boss is a bit lesser than before because of the worms i do think that raocow can do it! however, at the same time, i would understand if he decided not to! either is fine and i think that ive enjoyed this lp enough (and talking/thinking about it) that ill be satisfied with whatever happens!

i do think that theres a lot about wings of vi that i would change! however, regardless of how i feel, i do think that wings of vi does a better job of being this sort of hard game thats A Commercial Product than other ones ive seen! i still wouldnt buy it myself, but i respect it more than some other kinds of hard platformer games...
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by alleightbits »

8bitgamer123 wrote:I predict a ragequit in, at most, 2 more episode 0s.
I guessed what happened yesterday counts as a ragequit? So I was right, maybe?
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Ometeotl »

Well, that was an ending, I guess.
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by memnarch »

This was a neat game to watch, but very understandably frustrating on the bosses, especially the last one (on non-angel mode).

Thanks WhattayaBrian and raocow!
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by WhattayaBrian »

It was like half tedious.

Areas were easy, bosses were hard. You can just hold down the respawn button to continually die in areas. However, you need to actively transition to bosses, and the longest respawn-to-death was Kratarac, raocow's second worst boss. :P

I actually thought it would be fun to record the process of blazing through the game on angel mode and talk about the game (would've taken about an hour and a half). But then I found out that Wings of Vi crashes (sometimes) when you have fraps running. :( I hope Solgryn fixes that at some point.

There are three hidden places with chests in the final area. raocow found one of them.

The reason you end the game in a little nexus area is so you have free reign to warp around using the clock or do boss rush.

One day...one day raocow needs to go back and finish Valdis Story...
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Solaris »

im assuming that the two locked things in that one room are difficulty locked?

anyway im glad that you did it this way! it was really cool to see you just beat him on your first try hahah, what a difference :p
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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Grounder »






Two ending themes; one for those who liked the game, and one for those who didn't.

Anyway, that ending sure did happen...
Not that it really resolved anything.
Why don't you eat me?

I am perfectly tasty...

AND I'LL STEAL YOUR SOUL! :twisted:

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Re: Wings of Vi - Not Myougi's Castle

Post by Miyutwo »

Haha, that sure was anticlimactic.
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