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Testing and Development: Deadline-one week after comments

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TheGuyWhoIsSitting
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby TheGuyWhoIsSitting » 8 years ago

I don't know how much of an issue this is going to be, I did a little more work on my level, I can remember pretty much everything I did until my last back up, but my Desktop is on the fritz, it wont turn on properly and it wont output a video signal to my monitor, it shouldn't impede my progress, I hope. But this was really just perfect timing... I think I might be able to get the most up to date files off that hard drive, but if push comes to shove I didn't lose that much progress.

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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby TomPhanto » 8 years ago

Level 11E

This is the first draft of my second level.
My idea for the level was to have a junction that connected two paths. The first path being fire and the other, ice. My idea was to make it the connecting level between the fire and ice worlds.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Isocitration » 8 years ago

Okay so since no one has provided feedback in the last month or so I decided to completely redo the sublevel that I was dissatisfied with. I think it's much better now (though completely different).

Also, the custom MISC songs are silent for some reason, so just be aware that the star and goal music won't play.

There's two exits and of course the chest to find.
DSotM.zip
If I don't get any feedback this time I think I'll just go straight to clearing.
raocow wrote:you are dommed iso.

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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Argumentable » 8 years ago

Isocitration wrote: DSotM.zip

If I don't get any feedback this time I think I'll just go straight to clearing.
I played this, it seemed fine to me. I have two "minor annoyance" fixes to suggest but even with those I'd go ahead and clear it if it was in the clearing thread (if you want to speed things up just go ahead and submit it and link this post or something saying I would clear it)
a2tm - dsotm_00003.png
I would remove the two coins beside the parrot coin because they turn into blocks and make it very minorly annoying to get!!!
a2tm - dsotm_00002.png
Also I'd raise/lower one of these pipes so you have a 3 block space just to make it easier to get through with yoshi

But like I said these are very minor things and possibly even personal preference. Everything else I can't really think of a decent criticism about (maybe give the player more room to walk when you first visit the chest path), I found everything okay, nothing dickish, secret path and chest paths were a little more difficult than the main path as I feel they should be. So yeah, all good in my eyes. I'd still wait and see if anything else had something to say before rushing off to get it cleared, of course.
Also I can't believe you guys actually used clownball

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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 8 years ago

http://www.mediafire.com/?2mfie0038d2y3mm

Here is my new version. I made quite a few improvements. I decided to go back to the third portion being timed although I did give it more than last time. Also I don't understand why Paralars said the dinorhinos were weird. I thought that is how they are suppose to look in this hack. I might make some graphic improvements later on but I think I'm finished on level design.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby yogui » 8 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:Also I don't understand why Paralars said the dinorhinos were weird. I thought that is how they are suppose to look in this hack.
The graphism are correct, but the palette is bad. Change the sprite palette to 0 to fix that.

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There is a glitch when you hit blocks with dirt behind, you can see the background (=cut-off).

And I think there is some problem with the custom musics, I hear some harsh beep sound sometimes. Maybe you used an old addmusic? Or maybe it's my emulator's fault. I dunno.

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Also, a minor cut-off here that most people won't notice, but it's still a cut-off.

About the level: At first I thought it was just a normal level, a little boring, with dino rhino. And then I saw it was a big puzzle maze p-switch pipe parallel world party. Holy banana.
I haven't found the exit and the chest yet, but I will play it again later.
[enable_hats][/enable_hats]
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Paralars » 8 years ago

The dinorhinos have the correct graphics, but you should notice that their palette looks ugly.
Since you have no custom palette in 10F, you can just change the premade sprite palette in the dropdown box from 4 to 0/2/5/6.
The time limit with the sudden music change gives the ghost part a nice effect, where you have to figure it out in time or take one of the "emergency doors" to restart.
I recommend using the A2MT reset doors for those, you can insert them just like the pipe junctions, they are on the same graphics file and map16 page.
The "grains" in the landmasses in the icy part don't really fit, you should have a look at palette 2 there and experiment a bit with colors.
And your pro tip messagebox still has horrible grammar.
Well, even though I have no idea how to beat the ghost level part, I think you can go to Clearing after you take care of these things
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Isocitration » 8 years ago

Thanks Argu. Fixed up both of the things you mentioned (as well as extending the chest path entrance platform).
Argumentable wrote:Also I can't believe you guys actually used clownball
Actually, it's just me using it! The exgfx for it aren't actually in the base rom as far as I know.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Paralars » 8 years ago

TomPhanto:
Man, I read your description, saw the two pipes and thought
"There is gonna be a fire path and an ice path and they will be different and in character of their element"

Then I played the fire path first and I liked it.
(The melon block palettes don't fit)
Then I played the icy path and was kinda disappointed, it's basically the same tileset and sprite set, except slippery and hued blueish, I expected replacement for the things in the other path fitting the ice theme (for example you could have fireball bros and iceball bros), but you used pendulums, hotheads, podobos and lava in the icy path... yeah, wasted potential with that level idea I'd say, no offense.

What you did good was for example putting all the 5 coins in the one path and the treasure in the other, that's a good example of "opposite" element you could place in the sublevels, even if just exGFX.

You probably won't want to change anything anymore, since you already finished your level, just pointing that out. (You can still rework the level with an interesting, simple map16 tileset or some exGFX for sprites if you're interested in improving your level some more)

You should change the part with the pencils where there is one coming from the top and one coming from the ground, the bottom one doesn't let you walk over even if it's fully retracted.

The entrance room doesn't really fit with the Yoshi's Island 2 tileset, it should probably start in a cave or a cave entrance, right now it doesn't look good.

Overall I like your level gameplay-wise, it's not too hard.
It's just that the two paths don't seem very balanced, because they are too similarly themed and the ice path seems longer and harder to me (because it's basically the same but slippery)
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Cmbheadquarters » 8 years ago

http://bin.smwcentral.net/u/15352/024%2BAir%2BArena.ips

It's been a long time since I updated, the boss screwed up which put me off, so now it has only a mid way boss, then a goal poast. I think you'll like it. I really do think it is finished. (And I hope so too! Since the FINAL DEADLINE Thing.)

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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Wyatt » 8 years ago

CMB:
-Dear god there is so much echo on this music. Post the music code and I'll try and make it more reasonable
-Time limit feels short, try 400
-I didn't find the chest
-The boss is too hard. His first four hits are fine, but after that it comes down to praying that he won't be throwing a thing when you decide to jump on him. He should probably home in on you less, so that you can still get behind him to some extent. The final hit I just lucked into first try, but it has the same problem and I'm not too sure how to fix it.
-Escalators look cut off in second section. Morton's Castle had escalators, so look at that if you need some help.
-Put the boss at the end. Right now the pacing feels very off, and also you can walk back to the boss from the midpoint which doesn't make any sense.

Despite the problems, the actual level design is spot-on. You CAN get this level ready before the deadline, good luck on doing so!

EDIT: Difficulty is ★★☆ ignoring the boss issues.

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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 8 years ago

This might be the clearing version

http://www.mediafire.com/?ysmm7lddr8foljy

I'm not exactly sure if your music problem was the one I fixed. The Deadweight Bros were making awful noises that seemed part of the music so I replaced them with Sledge Bros. Is that the the music problem you were talking about?

The grains were changed to light blue, as I thought they looked better than removing them.

I also had a captain check my grammar. I assume it was the "s" in "gives" that was bothering paralars. it is now "give".

The reset doors would be better without the arrows, but I think the purpose of the doors is clearer now.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby 7TC7 » 8 years ago

spitznagl wrote:-I liked!!!!!!
Thank you!
spitznagl wrote:-The water/ground checkerboard pattern is a neat touch. Have you considered playing with different dither patterns?
I tried a few different things. The checkerboard is the only one, that really seemed to look right. The transition to the big water part is actually a bit different, but it's really not very obvious.
spitznagl wrote:-The only section that felt boring to me was the one with the different characters and figures floating in the water. It's a great idea considering your tileset, but I personally would add more of those objects in that area and make them intersect together, without making it a maze though. It would still be a swimming section with not much to do, but with more to look at, it would certainly feel more complete.
I think you ment something different, when you said "intersect them", but I changed them. They no longer are a lot of single pictures but now try to tell a little story. Thats nice, I hope. Also, they do intersect a little!
I didn't want to make that part of the swimming section a maze of any kind, as you have to go through it twice (or trice) to get the chest of the stage. I actually put the two blue goopas at the beginning of the water part there, so that it is possible to steal their shells for faster swimming (or getting rid of those pesky Rip-van-fish).
spitznagl wrote:-I really liked the transitions from water to ground and vice versa. It feels like pressurized rooms under the sea or something. It would be really nice IMO to have those more present, but I guess that you might not feel like making this kind of change at this stage.
Yeah, it's a bit hard to change many big scale things like that at this point. Anyways, happy you like it.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Paralars » 8 years ago

the deadwight bros weren't the bleeps, maybe it's just me, whatever.
I noticed the treasure box sometimes doesnt spawn, because of the ghosts and eeries I guess.
Whatever, you should post in Clearing now.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby TomPhanto » 8 years ago

The first screen will NOT be final. But I'll start the ice path all over. I'm also planning to use different graphics for the two areas.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Jesuiscontent » 8 years ago

Hey there guys !

I'm happy to introduce you the first version of my level, Dancing with Shells (level 115). It's the red dot level on the overworld. (There is only ONE exit though, it's just to male it stand out)

http://bin.smwcentral.net/u/17829/Dancingwithshells.ips

Feel free to point out every part you think can be improved, I'm trying my best to be ready to submit by the time the deadline comes.

Just a small notice : The 5 dragons coins and the chest are all in the level, in case you're not finding one of them for some reason.

I'm especially waiting for feedback concerning the difficulty since I'm constantly tweaking around making the level easier or harder. And don't hesitate to bash me about my possibly wierd palette choice, hah!
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Paralars » 8 years ago

I like the music and the concept a lot!
But, I don't know if you have heard about the concept of cutoff being bad, because it is all over the place.
cutoff.png
There's a lot more, for example pipes next to water and corner tiles.

your foreground palette looks poorly made, it#s okay to have it weird greenish and outstanding, but the colors don't match, have a look at that.
In the vertical segment, I recommend using layer 2 water and a layer 3 background instead of a layer 2 background and layer 3 water, because it's really awkward how the premade layer 3 tide
- pushes you to the left in a level that seems "balanced" to both directions (that level isn't really built around the concept of being pushed to the left).
- is really low.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby alex2 » 8 years ago

Powerups completely done, save points are 50% done, blocks are 90% done, graphics are about 30% done...level is 0% done.

Gonna probably need an extension at this rate.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby raocow » 8 years ago

Considering you have decided to take way too big a bite I'm willing to give you an extension, if you can garantee to be done... let's say two weeks after the deadline. As in, two weeks after, you got something in the clearing thread.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby alex2 » 8 years ago

raocow wrote:Considering you have decided to take way too big a bite
Way too big? It'd be too big if we weren't able to handle it, which we have been able to pretty well thus far. I think it's just because we jumped in so late (less than a month ago).

We should have something done by then. We've been working painstakingly hard to get all of the ASM done and out of the way for the past week or so, and we're pretty close to being done with all of it. All that's really left is a background, music, and the level itself.

Thank you.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Paralars » 8 years ago

how come a background equals 70% of graphics?
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Ometeotl » 8 years ago

And why is the level itself considered such a small part of making a...level.

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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby alex2 » 8 years ago

Paralars wrote:how come a background equals 70% of graphics?
It doesn't. Between the time of my posting that, and my response to raocow, we finished the graphics for three more things.

It's probably like 60% now. The background will take a lot of work, mind you.
Ometeotl wrote:And why is the level itself considered such a small part of making a...level.
When did I say it's a small part? One cannot properly create and test a level without functioning resources (in our case, the load of ASM), so we've left that to be last. The level designing itself shouldn't take too long, anyway. We've already brainstormed ideas for it, and we have three other people assisting us with ideas, so it's really a non-issue.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Jesuiscontent » 8 years ago

Paralars wrote:I like the music and the concept a lot!
But, I don't know if you have heard about the concept of cutoff being bad, because it is all over the place.
cutoff.png
There's a lot more, for example pipes next to water and corner tiles.

your foreground palette looks poorly made, it#s okay to have it weird greenish and outstanding, but the colors don't match, have a look at that.
In the vertical segment, I recommend using layer 2 water and a layer 3 background instead of a layer 2 background and layer 3 water, because it's really awkward how the premade layer 3 tide
- pushes you to the left in a level that seems "balanced" to both directions (that level isn't really built around the concept of being pushed to the left).
- is really low.
Thanks for your feedback !

About the cutoff parts : Ow, I've forgot some quite ugly ones, sorry about that.

About the palette : Yeah, I was king of worried about that, the thing is that I am absolutely terrible at graphics, art, colors and whatnot, but I wanted to modify at least the palette so that the level doesn't look too "bland". I'll try to improve it but I really have trouble with that kind of stuff :P

About the vertical level part : Well, actually I really tried to balance that area around that mechanic. I wanted to "reward" the player for progressing ahead of the water (by bouncing on koopas and stuff) by granting him more movement, whereas falling in the water would be "punished" by suffering altered movement (that's where I think using tide water instead of plain water makes sense).
That's also why I tried to make the parrot coins difficult to get if you're cowardly sitting in the water, but easier if you're climbing using ennemies and ground. The only exception is the 3-pathway area of course. Wow, I don't know if I managed to convey my point here, but bear with me :mrgreen:

Oh another thing : Did you find the chest? I put it in a sort of "hard to see" passage, but since I already knew it was here I can't test myself if it is noticeable at all for someone who doesn't expect it.
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Re: Testing and Development: Deadline Nov. 17th

Postby Paralars » 8 years ago

Well I didn't play through the whole thing, just until the midpoint and the first few vertical screens.
I found the vine leading to the pipe leading to a room full of shell kicking guys, but I only had a peek and rewinded back.
Okay if you say the vertical thing IS desiged around the movement thing, then I trust you, I just didn't think that it was like that because you have to go both to the left and right a lot and the three-split path thing didn't seem like there was a special one I'd prefer choosing (to me at least) - but forget about that.
The palette is pretty good, it's just the green-cyan-grey transition at the top of the stones that bothers me.
You could just replace color 27 with something more blue-ish and it would look a lot better.
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