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Level Finalization/QA List (Tweaking of Inserted Levels)

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Septentrion Pleiades
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 7 years ago

Something to do with layer 2 music is different from when I submitted(even though the old music is listed on the wiki, now under my name). I just want to know what happened there.

Also in the same level(sublevel 1c3) the munchers have been switched to a different color, but a few are still the old color.

edit: The music also crashed in the final sublevel, last time I checked.
Last edited by Septentrion Pleiades on 11 Sep 2012, 23:06, edited 1 time in total.
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MrDeePay
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby MrDeePay » 7 years ago

Dances with Shells:
- Cutoff ledge on screens 0F and 12, level 115.
- Cutoff on screen 08 of level C2. (Note the Turn Blocks)
- The jump on screen 07 of level 115 is a bitch to make and it pretty out of place compared to the rest of the level. It's an ambush and a extremly percise jump to make at the same time.
Dodge the Beefsteak!:
- Remove the power-up block from screen 02. It's completely unnecessary, too close to the one on screen 02, and THAT one is actually necessary to get up to the ledge that leads to the secret exit.
- The background in level 191 could use some better contrast.
- Is the upper pipe in level 191, screen 00 actually supposed to lead to that ghost house?
- Can't seem to find my way into that area with all of the coins (and enemies) right in front of the midpoint.
- Level drastically gets easier after the midway with most of the enemies being able to be easily slid into or jumped over. It's as if the level was thrown together.
Forest of Realism:
- Music breaks on the cave section in accurate emulators because you used the base SMW cave theme.
Adamantium Castle:
- Introducting these "passable from above/below" blocks over a pit of lava probably isn't the best idea.
- You'll be hearing more from me on this.
Coin Town USA:
- The Frog Lotus on screen 07/08 is blindish and can take the player by surprise thanks to just being out of the camera's view.
- The level itself doesn't strike me right either, due to the very nature of the objective and how it's layed out. Not much I can do about it.
Farenheit Something:
- The level as a whole is wasted potential to the fire/ice concept and is fitting for "first half of the game" status (It's basically two completely different mini-levels meshed to share one OW level. There are plenty of things that could be done with it from the basic stuff seen in the Galaxy games to managing the temeperature of the environment.
- The Ice section is the worst of the two. Most of the enemies can be dispatched from afar thanks to fireballs or sliding into them. The only real trouble that the player will encounter is not slipping off of the timed or diagonal platforms.
- The Fire section is better, but not by too much. Most of it is waiting for hazards to pass by before continuing on.
A Gelatin Factory:
- SP2 is using the ASMT version.
- Two effortless 1-ups. (one in the layer 2 section and another in the turn blocks with the Duck Wiggler)
- The level itself suffers from some wasted potential, especially when you have gelatin that bounces the player (as well as one form that's affected by sprites). This could've been used to provide setups that had Demo and enemies bouncing around in tandem instead of... what we have now.
Ye Olde Spookhouse:
- Outdated SP2.
- Demo appears behind the scenery when entering/exiting pipes in level 140, screens 00 and 02. </trivial>
- I may have some LevelASM code lying around that will make Demo's initial position face level on level entry (levels 13D-13E)
- Harmless enemies running about in level 140. Parakoopa and one Ninji (screen 05), another Ninja (screen 07), more Parakoopas (screens 08, and 0B-0C), and an Eerie (screen 0C). Then again, those all may be cosmetic appeal.
- Nice music, BTW. It helps enhance the setting very well though I'd consider a palette upgrade.

Into the Sky Castle!:
- This level just feels inflated and plays out like it just goes on and on.
- Why is the first power-up in the level about 17 screens into it? Yes, it's on screen 05, but you do a lot of back and forth traveling through all six- assuming you don't screw up on the shell trickery.
- To compare, the next power-up is a mere FOUR straightforward screens afterwards.
- The On/Off blocks are miscolored. Assign whatever is using palette 7 to 2 and move the palette row to there as well. Assuming it doesn't conflict with anything else in the hack.
- The On/Off Thwomps are basically a guessing game since they don't react to the player's proximity until it's time for them to crash down.
- Pesky platforming segments on screen 10-11 thanks to the two vertical blocks (both the ones below the 4x2 format and the ones alone) being oh so in the way. The former is more of a bother because of the PMS Thwomp being oh so in the way. I saw remove the left Thwomp.
- The line guide on screen 18 is broken, rendering the level unbeatable.
- Hell, you could probably do without the cruft in screens 16-18, excluding the broken line guide.
- Screen 0C rubs me the wrong way, but I'll leave that alone since I know for sure I'll be back in this level.

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swirlybomb
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby swirlybomb » 7 years ago

MrDeePay wrote:Ye Olde Spookhouse:
- Outdated SP2.
- Demo appears behind the scenery when entering/exiting pipes in level 140, screens 00 and 02. </trivial>
- I may have some LevelASM code lying around that will make Demo's initial position face level on level entry (levels 13D-13E)
- Harmless enemies running about in level 140. Parakoopa and one Ninji (screen 05), another Ninja (screen 07), more Parakoopas (screens 08, and 0B-0C), and an Eerie (screen 0C). Then again, those all may be cosmetic appeal.
- Nice music, BTW. It helps enhance the setting very well though I'd consider a palette upgrade.
-Is this something that would be covered by whoever's working on the master copy, or something I should be addressing myself? I'm not sure what it is, if so.
-While it would be 'cleaner' if this didn't happen, I think the scenery tiles keep the area more coherent, as it were. Or something.
-That'd be groovy.
-The first and last Parakoopas you mentioned are for cosmetic appeal (theoretically?), and the Ninji on screen 05 that falls straight into the whole is just a quick gag. But all the other enemies you listed do get in the player's way (the latter ones are meant to if you're jumping too high on the Ninjis below them), so I wouldn't call them harmless. But if some enemy rejiggering is necessary, I can do that (unless it's minor enough that a higher-up would do so instead).
-It's just the 'default' ghost house theme (though does anyone else use it?), but I do think it works really well for the level. Would you have any particular suggestions on what the palette ought to be?
Also: thanks for the feedback, yo.
If I might say so, it's nice to see that it's mostly little things rather than something outright wrong with the level.
anonymousbl00dlust wrote:All the obstacles in my level can be beaten on the players first attempt without any 'future predicting'.
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SyStemkraSh5642
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby SyStemkraSh5642 » 7 years ago

@ Septentrion Pleiades: That's really strange; I remember your song being inserted in the last baseROM. I checked the addmusic file and it seems that 55 was removed. Nice catch.

@ MrDeePay:
Dances with Shells:
The issues mentioned are fixed. I added a flat tile on the right side of the platform at 7 to make it easier.
Dodge the Beefsteak:
Instead of removing the power-up block on screen 2, I replaced it with a coin block. Based off how the clouds were placed, I'm assuming that the player was supposed to jump off the block on screen 2 instead of screen 0. The pipe definitely isn't supposed to go to the ghost house level. I dug through his posts searching for his original level submission, and it seems that the pipe was supposed to use secondary exit #090, which was supposed to lead to that one section near the midpoint with the coins. It should be fixed now. Also, if you die at level 190, the game freezes during transition. I've only been able to do it once; the game over music didn't play, and I think I remember hearing one of the instruments fizzing out. The next time I tried to do this, I died like normal. Lastly, the segment after the midpoint has also been made a bit harder; I've made a few changes to the enemy placement.
Forest of Realism:
Does SNES9X 1.53 count as an accurate emulator? I haven't been able to get the music to break. Also, I removed the sign from the forest part of the level; the graphics were glitched.
Adamantium Castle:
The pit of lava has been covered with the custom blocks that act like rope.
Coin Town USA:
I moved the lotus one tile up. You can see the top of it when you wait on the edge slightly sticking out of the wall.
Farenheit Something:
I can't really do much here without changing the entire level.
A Gelatin Factory:
I don't understand what you meant by the first dash. As for the 1-ups, there actually seem to be 6 scattered around the level. I removed three of them.
Ye Olde Spookhouse:
I don't know what's outdated about SP2. The glitch where you enter/exit the pipe behind the background should be fixed. I've also made a few changes to make the harmless enemies on 140 more of a threat. Also, if you would like to submit your code, I'll ask limepie20 and see what happens from there.
Into the Sky Castle!:
I've placed a mushroom block on screen 00.It may be a bit of a journey to the next power-up, but I think putting 2 would make things too easy. I tried to change to palette for the penguin switch block, but every row has been filled up with other colors. The positions of the thwomps and the blocks on screen 10-11 have been changed slightly as well. Lastly, the line guide on screen 18 has been fixed.

Thank you for catching all of this, MrDeePay. I'm glad you've caught some of the problems in the game.

@ Swirlybomb: I'll take care of it to save time. All of the things I've done in your level are mentioned above.

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Diortem
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Diortem » 7 years ago

Good work both of ya! That's quite some level testing and progress here.

limepie20
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby limepie20 » 7 years ago

Yeah DeePay, we love it when you test our levels. Keep going of you'd like.
And Systemkrash, awesome job keeping up.

MrDeePay
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby MrDeePay » 7 years ago

Forest of Realism:
Does SNES9X 1.53 count as an accurate emulator? I haven't been able to get the music to break. Also, I removed the sign from the forest part of the level; the graphics were glitched.
As far as Super Mario World goes, Snes9x 1.52+ (and bsnes, obviously) is considered accurate. If you can't get it to break, then chances are the base ROM got updated between the time I made feedback posts and just didn't notice.

I'm busy playing catchup with everything online (I was without internet for three days.), so an edit may be pending later on.

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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby MrDeePay » 7 years ago

I was without internet for a few days, so I figured I'd do some more jumping around with the inserted levels. This list ignores issues from other play-testers that may have been noted already (such as the things Septentrion Pleiades brought up), but a good reminder never hurt. I found out the issue with the outdated SP2, though. It was caused by the game changing the sprites, palettes, etc of it when level 125 (Coin Town USA) was beaten. Just change the special world levels to 0, 100, 10A, or some other unused level. GFX 145, and 15C are still at least partially outdated.

General:
Consider adding this to your list of hex edits.

org $00F619 ; Prevents screen from scrolling when Mario loses a life.
db $12,$14 ; Would prevent certain things from being "spoilered" because the player saw
;something they "should not have after dying.
Punctuated Time:
- Fill in the entire bottom row where dirt should be with... dirt. It's producing some minor, but noticable cuttoff currently.
- Use the slopefix block for the tile where the slope and the wall (above the pipe) connect. It's possible to get into the dirt that way, though you won't be getting anywhere.
- Blank message box.

(level is unplayble beyond these two screens because there's no known way for me to enter the pipe. a tiny bit of editing the level through LM is making the rest of this writeup possible)

- Not a fan of the Ambush Thwomp here.
- The bottom tile of the first bullet cannon (screen 04) is not there.
- The fan blocks don't want to work. Are their respective ASM files inserted and these simply haven't been assigned yet?
- Level is virtually unbeatable in its current form (screen 0B-0C). I'll be coming back here.
Irritating...:
- Far too much red makes this level rather, uh, irritating to look it. It's similar to An Echnoing Call in that regard (though for different reasons) and I assume the level author intended to do this with the level, designer intention and application aren't necessarily the same. A more subdued palette that includes browns, greys, an various heat-tinted colors should work out better here while still maintaining the heat theme. The stone blocks with the current palette look especially ugly.
- You should hint out to the player on screen 04 (top) and screen 05 (bottom) that the main route is the high road.
- Replace every instance of tile 2C ("purple" coin) with 2B (normal coin). 2C still behaves like a coin even when the Blue P-Switch is active.
- No opinion on the Mushroom on screen 06 since I'm still unsure as to how the Switch blocks and OW will work in this collab.
- The Mushroom on screen 08 seems pointless since there's another on two screens later.
- Small amount of cutoff on screen 10.
- The remarkable slow pace of the level (climbing, narrow passages with wide spreading attacks and sawblades) doesn't do anything for me as a whole.
Betrayal Rock:
- Right off the bat, I'm surprised that the level is a lot less offensive than I was expecting it to be. Of course, I was expecting "irredeemably bad"... so yeah, I had very low expectations coming into this. Regardless, the level really wears on you due to the sheer length and tedium of it. (To the point that success is largely luck-based (especially that spot on level 49, screen 4; bottom/mid) and dependant on trial and error. I hate it for any unfortunate (legit player) bastard that dies anytime during the second half; or worse- accidentally hits a power-up when they make it back to the starting area small. This level should be an easy mutliple midpoints candidate.
- I'll give raocow credit for making the "wait out the P-Switch segments" in the level a lot more interesting than what your average designer would do.
- Difficult to see the bottom on-screen row of level 2F because of the gradient.
- Palette 2 in general is just sloppy and looks really bad on the wooden crates and blocks. The pipe on screen 06, level 11 is poor as well.
- Level 4A just reaffirms my stance on utilizing the directional hurt blocks more.
Down to Green:
- Level 12 feel very empty, unthreatening and most of the enemies can be avoided with relative ease. Granted, this most likely will be an early-game level, but even then, some more threatening (but still easy) setups could help the level out a good amount. No real complaints for level AC, though.
Sky Castle West:
- Sledge/Bomb Bros' hammers/bombs are Palette B when they're being held. You'll need to change the properties of those in the Bros' ASM files to read from Palette A.
- Switch blocks exist here. See my comment about them on Irritating...
- Magic Bro on level 36, screen 00 can hilariously jump into the ground.
- If the level's going to have time, then add at least 50-100 to it. I never failed through time-up, though I'm arguably a better player than many people that play these hacks. Regardless, in both of my play-throughs of this level I had the Hurry Up SFX to play, and I wasn't even dicking around!
- Having Ice and Magic Bros (they share the same palette) in the same sublevel is non-intuitive.
P-Switch Beach:
- Player dies upon entry to level 46.
Interwined Plains:
- Player dies upon entry.
Demo's Hydrophobia:
- Possible to make the Jumping Statue on screen 01 to jump into the ceiling.
- The coins on screens 01-02, left, are not intuitive enough that they lead to a spike.
- Music in levels FC-FD break on accurate emulators.
A Menagerie In Glass:
- Level 155 (i wonder what the reference is!!!1!)'s pipe exits aren't exactly intuitive enough to indicate that they exit the area.
Where am I?:
- Swoopers on screens 0B and 0F-11 (bottom) are too low to be any plausible threat.
- Ambush Thwomp on level A8, screen 02. The setup made here doesn't exactly tip players off to the coins being the indicator. A setup that has the player free from harm should work better here.
- Furthermore, the formation you have on screen 09, top left, doesn't help matters at all.
Replace the leges on level A8 screens 00-02 with lighter colored ones. The currents ones can be mistaken for scenery easily.
- Power-up generosity. You provide a Flower on level 1B screen 0F (the exit to the next area is on screen 10) and the next power-up is on screen 01 of level A8! This is followed up with another one on screen 04 and the final power-up is on screen 0A!
- Not a fan of these types of secret exit paths. (read: the ones there you have to basically play through most of the level twice, but with a detour.)
Undermoore Passage:
- The level as a whole can wear you out due to the sheer length and slowish pacing of it. That may be me doing the level at 3:15am and wanting to go to sleep, though.
- Not a fan of the water section being Big Demo Discrimination (BDD); the layer 3 plunger doesn't help matters either.
- The BG in the swamp areas is in a fixed position and scrolling.
- Palette in the underwater portion could use a more swampy color scheme to be more consistent with the dry segments.
Forest of Realism:
- Sign on level 118 screen 09 is glitched.
- Cave music still breaks on accurate emulators.
Forest Fever:
- Any particular reason these canopies are solid?
- Hell, there's a bunch of broken map16 behaviors with tiles behaving solid when they shouldn't be. Open up the Map16 Editor and go to Page 3D- the only thing on that page that really should be solid are the ledges.
- Exit in level 1CB leads to a completely irrelevant level that cannot be cleared.
Mansion of Onoffness:
- Level 170, screens 00-01 are a complete pain in the ass to make it through; though I shouldn't expect any different from the noseman999. Timed segment, zero room for error, and you'll have to redo about 2-3 minutes of level every time you fail this segment. Screen 02 is kind of pushing it, but the last jump before the door and knowing when/where/how to hit the switch and make it to safe ground is an exercise in frustration.
- Why the hell do I have to redo screens 00-01 of level 171 if something on screens 03-04 goes wrong?
- Level 172 can be best described as padding and artificial difficulty. Searching for On/Off switches while contending with solid objects in the dark? Come on now.
A Beach:
- Crossfire Bills have inconsistent graphics.
- Surely these side rooms (level 128, screens 07-08) can be decorated more so these doors don't seem like they're just out in the middle of nowhere.
- I'm nore sure what's the intended solution with making it to the top of screens 03-04. I just spun jumped off the Phantos while hugging the right wall.
- I'll be coming back to this level, I'm sure.
Deja Vu:
- Miscolored sawblades in level 126.
- Initial FG position to level 149 (second half) is too low.
- If the Yellow Switch is active, the player can cirumvent most of the level from level 148 screen 00.
- This level has 11 painstakingly easy lives to get. Two of those are only available if you have the Yellow/Green Switch, however, but still.
- Level 148 has no buoyancy.
(random note)
- This collab really loves using Thwomps.

Light and Darkness:
- What Axem said.
- Level could really use a checkpoint at the start of the auto-scroll. The sublevel goes on for quite a bit.
- Boss is a pain in the ass for what I suppose would be obvious reasons.
Multi-Tier Hillside:
- Jump at the top of level 132, screen 07-08 is an End of Jump Enemy Encounter, which is basically a forced hit.
- Checkpoint is very easy to miss if you stick to the top.
- Very small amount of glitched graphics (look at the right ledge) at the bottom of screen 0D.
- The level as a whole is pretty neat, if I must say so myself.
P-Key's Mansion:
- Boo "Laser" and Eerie are miscolored.
- "ruins," not "ruins."
- Spikes in underwater section are also miscolored.
- FG entrance to level 85 is too low.
- Status bar's palette in level 84 is inconsistent compared to the rest of the level.
- Does this level even have a normal exit?
Demo Kong Country:
- I'm sure the Mini-Necky's nuts moved much quicker than these.
- *flush*
- Mini-Necky falls for a second after being defeated then just disappears. I guess it's not a Dahnamics sprite unless it has some noticable technical error.
- Goopa on level 0D screen 06 bottom is an EEE.
- Horizontal Zingers move much quicker to the left than they do to the right.
- Vertictal Zingers move much quicker up than they do down.
- Broken music in the bonus rooms because of the lack of samples. Just replace the song with another bonus track. Maybe that Japanese one that's seen in those types of hacks perhaps? After fixing it to be AM4 friendly, of course.
- Power-up on level 0D screen 0F appears behind the foliage for a brief moment.
- ROM crashes on screen 03 of level 186. This level is currently unbeatable.

(a little bit of level editing later to temporarily remove the buggy blocks...)

- Screen exit 05 of level 185 sends Demo to Land of Illusions.
- Mini-Necky on level D screen 14 is too high to be any plausible threat.
Magical Lava Zone:
- Where's the chest in this one?
Chilly Ice Cave:
- The bottom and left halves of the lava streams are safe to the touch.
- When doing the return trip with the Blue P-Switch, it'd be nice if the player knew that they'd need to activate the Silver P-Switch again. (level AE, screen 01) Currently they're in for a pleasant surprise when they drop down.
- Why am I forced to wait out the P-Switch? (level AE, screen 03-04)
- The Monty Mole on level B0 screen 05 is not a threat at all.
- The Bunny Rex on level AE screen 06 poses no threat.
- Pointless Yoshi that treats him like a disposable object. ...Yeah I'm not even gonna waste my time trying to discuss that here.
- Timer's pretty low (the hurry up sfx played for me when I wasn't even dicking around).
A.D.D.:
- The level as a whole just feels very weak, and I'm not talking about the random change in themes either. A majority of the enemies can be dispacthed easily by sliding into them or ignoring them altogether.
- Lopsidedish midpoint. Either move the current one somewhere in the water segment or add a second one at the start of the Ghost House portion.

Goofy Grotto:
- The Blurp only has one frame of animation.
- The Parrot Coin outline are glitched graphics.
- Poor Item Memory Index. Collecting certain coins in levels 6B-6C makes getting the chest in level 133 impossible, assuming the player doesn't die. Since none of the areas in the level are ever revisited, you can safely set the Item Memory Index to each of these levels to 3.
- The Note Blocks display glitched graphics when bounced on.
A Stroll Beneath the Stars:
- Why is this ledge/vine tile solid? (Tile 1301 and 1340) There's a cutsom block for setups like those.
- Time limit's a little too low for a first timer to this level. An extra 100 seconds should do.
Something to do with layer 2:
- Level 1C3, screen 0C-0D. Just how is the player supposed to make that jump?
- What's with the random change in setting/theme for level 1C4? It would be more beneficial to keep the forest theme to continue going on with this level (especially with level 1BF being right back in a forest) instead of going "Russian Rickroll" on the player.
- The timing (and player's form) to get the Parrot coin on level 1C4 screen 07 is so percise that you'd need to know about it beforehand to stand any chance of getting it.
- The second half of the level is (a lot) easier than the first.
- Level 1BF has no music, so the game freeze up when the player tries to go to that level.

limepie20
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby limepie20 » 7 years ago

Wow, you are the best. Thanks for this list of stuff to fix.

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raocow
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby raocow » 7 years ago

heck yeah I'm redeemable!
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Argumentable » 7 years ago

MrDeePay wrote: (random note)
- This collab really loves using Thwomps.
If there's anything I learned from MATH2 it's that people with bad levels love their thwomps

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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby S.N.N. » 7 years ago

I like how if MDP were to point out flaws in any other hack (say, in an LP thread), he'd get shot down with the cruelest of sarcasm, but as soon as he does it here he becomes the best person in the world.

Hmm.

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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby limepie20 » 7 years ago

This is like pre-beta testing. I don't know why random levels and blocks stop working, but that stuff should be fixed. Also, gameplay tweaks never hurt.

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raocow
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby raocow » 7 years ago

To be fair, he'd be shot down by Alex. Most of us are pretty open to these things!
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Argumentable » 7 years ago

I moreso shoot him down for not letting things go (or at least in my mind I have) but hey whatever

Septentrion Pleiades
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 7 years ago

S.N.N. wrote:I like how if MDP were to point out flaws in any other hack (say, in an LP thread), he'd get shot down with the cruelest of sarcasm, but as soon as he does it here he becomes the best person in the world.

Hmm.
It's a bit different when someone says something before the hack comes out than when complaining about a game they don't fully understand after watching someone have a bad day with the game.
MrDeePay wrote:Something to do with layer 2:
- Level 1C3, screen 0C-0D. Just how is the player supposed to make that jump?
- What's with the random change in setting/theme for level 1C4? It would be more beneficial to keep the forest theme to continue going on with this level (especially with level 1BF being right back in a forest) instead of going "Russian Rickroll" on the player.
- The timing (and player's form) to get the Parrot coin on level 1C4 screen 07 is so percise that you'd need to know about it beforehand to stand any chance of getting it.
- The second half of the level is (a lot) easier than the first.
- Level 1BF has no music, so the game freeze up when the player tries to go to that level
I was aiming for somewhat cruel first half, but the solution to the jump is actually quite common in hacks. It''s just presented differently.
The change in the level was somewhat intentional. I not opposed to making the second half a bit harder.
The parrot coin only has to be gotten once in the entire play through. This isn't the only parrot coin I place with that in mind. Remember the freefalling springboard in another level of mine? Have fun pulling your hair out.
I already mentioned this baserom issue
raocow wrote:heck yeah I'm redeemable!
He wasn't talking about further over there.

I would like to point out that all of misterdeepay's suggestions might be lost in this thread as people comment. We already have a poor attempt of listing all the level changes needed in the first post. Giving MDP power over the first post of this thread, or having a mod take care of it might make this process easier.

Also, the switch palaces haven't' been reviewed by MDP. Have you tested the rest of the levels and found no problems you would like to share?
Last edited by Septentrion Pleiades on 06 Oct 2012, 18:46, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby limepie20 » 7 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:I would like to point out that all of misterdeepay's suggestions might be lost in this thread as people comment. We already have a poor attempt of listing all the level changes needed in the first post. Giving MDP power over the first post of this thread, or having a mod take care of it might make this process easier.
Systemkrash should be working on all of these, so they shouldn't get lost.
Hopefully he will notify me or something if he isn't doing it. (I've already notified him about these suggestions.)

But hey, systemkrash, you are a better rom manager than I was, so I know you'll do fine with these.

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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 7 years ago

limepie20 wrote:
Septentrion Pleiades wrote:
Systemkrash should be working on all of these, so they shouldn't get lost.
Hopefully he will notify me or something if he isn't doing it. (I've already notified him about these suggestions.)

But hey, systemkrash, you are a better rom manager than I was, so I know you'll do fine with these.
A little help organizing wouldn't hurt, especially as he seems busy with real life. A few weeks worth of looking back in threads isn't to efficient. Is it possible to make a new post as an opening to the thread so all the requested changes list can be done by someone who isn't a mod? I wouldn't mind keep track of something like that myself.

As for systemkrash being less than active, It would be nice if he could give an update every week.
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby limepie20 » 7 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:A little help organizing wouldn't hurt, especially as he seems busy with real life. A few weeks worth of looking back in threads isn't to efficient. Is it possible to make a new post as an opening to the thread so all the requested changes list can be done by someone who isn't a mod? I wouldn't mind keep track of something like that myself.
Alright, that sounds like a good idea. Go for it.
You can edit the OP now.

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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 7 years ago

It'll take a while for my just to get all the levels down and go through, but I should be done by the end of the weekend. I have already decided on how the list will look like and started edits.
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby limepie20 » 7 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:It'll take a while for my just to get all the levels down and go through, but I should be done by the end of the weekend. I have already decided on how the list will look like and started edits.
Wow, it's looking great so far, though. I like the system you've devised.

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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby AUS » 7 years ago

I'm more inclined to shoot MDP down because he hasn't said anything about my level and I'm getting anxious here. :lol:
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby MrDeePay » 7 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:Also, the switch palaces haven't' been reviewed by MrDeePay. Have you tested the rest of the levels and found no problems you would like to share?
- I go through various levels at a time and just post comments on them if I have anything "worthwhile" to say about it. I am critical towards a fair number of the levels' designs as you may have seen here and there (A Gelatin Factory, Farenheit Something, ADD, etc.), but my proposed solutions for those issues are much greater than "simple things". Of course, I could attribute that to me just having higher standards than the average person.

- I play through these levels multiple times in case I've missed something in my first, second, third, or even seventh play-through. This is rather commonplace for me however. (I've sent in multiple updates to my own SMWCP2 levels despite them being accepted/inserted for over a year now, for example.) Just because I didn't cover the level yet doesn't mean I haven't played it; I have played through most of the levels in the base so far (yes, that includes further over there), but I just haven't gotten to writing up on those yet. Furthermore, just because I covered a level already doesn't mean I won't go back to it if I see something else.

- I didn't play the Switch Palaces yet because I have no idea how you get into those.
It's a bit different when someone says something before the hack comes out than when complaining about a game they don't fully understand after watching someone have a bad day with the game.
I'm not like the groups of people that will cry bloody murder if/when they see raocow struggle on something for one reason or another. Those people are more likely to say/do whatever to make raocow feel better- like a(n over)protective parent- and/or just go by what he says/shows. (Much of the "conflict" with raocow's general fanbase and SMWC can be related to raocow's "unreliable" status on that front, for example.

While the best way to make a proper assessment on a level is to try it out yourself, it's possible to call out more flagrant examples if you see them. More subtle things such as stuff you can't properly assess from an LP will need a play-through from the player.

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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 7 years ago

limepie20 wrote:
Septentrion Pleiades wrote:It'll take a while for my just to get all the levels down and go through, but I should be done by the end of the weekend. I have already decided on how the list will look like and started edits.
Wow, it's looking great so far, though. I like the system you've devised.
I tried out putting MDP's post into the format and it seems good. I wonder if Systemkrash has the power to edit it because of his "Hack collaborator" powers, or if we will juggle ownership of the first post. I think the hack collaborator status should allow for mod power in the collaborator extracaganze forum. Either way, I do plan on having a polished OP.
MrDeePay wrote:
Septentrion Pleiades wrote:Also, the switch palaces haven't' been reviewed by MrDeePay. Have you tested the rest of the levels and found no problems you would like to share?
- I go through various levels at a time and just post comments on them if I have anything "worthwhile" to say about it. I am critical towards a fair number of the levels' designs as you may have seen here and there (A Gelatin Factory, Farenheit Something, ADD, etc.), but my proposed solutions for those issues are much greater than "simple things". Of course, I could attribute that to me just having higher standards than the average person.

- I play through these levels multiple times in case I've missed something in my first, second, third, or even seventh play-through. This is rather commonplace for me however. (I've sent in multiple updates to my own SMWCP2 levels despite them being accepted/inserted for over a year now, for example.) Just because I didn't cover the level yet doesn't mean I haven't played it; I have played through most of the levels in the base so far (yes, that includes further over there), but I just haven't gotten to writing up on those yet. Furthermore, just because I covered a level already doesn't mean I won't go back to it if I see something else.

- I didn't play the Switch Palaces yet because I have no idea how you get into those.
overworld edits to levels:

22 - Cirno & Septentrion Pleiades
103 - Lv27MarkerMMan
121 - Septentrion Pleiades
123 - Jolpengammler

door edit to:
F9 - SyStemkraSh5642
FA - Isocitration
FB - Wyatt
MrDeePay wrote:
I'm not like the groups of people that will cry bloody murder if/when they see raocow struggle on something for one reason or another. Those people are more likely to say/do whatever to make raocow feel better- like a(n over)protective parent- and/or just go by what he says/shows. (Much of the "conflict" with raocow's general fanbase and SMWC can be related to raocow's "unreliable" status on that front, for example.

While the best way to make a proper assessment on a level is to try it out yourself, it's possible to call out more flagrant examples if you see them. More subtle things such as stuff you can't properly assess from an LP will need a play-through from the player.
I'm sorry, but my point is criticism is more of an accept quality during development. After ASMT came out the was a sublevel (zaqaar's hell) that everyone suddenly started to have a problem with. I spend more time in the collab area, so I was going of SNN's impression of you.
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Re: Final Tweaking of Inserted Levels

Postby limepie20 » 7 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:I tried out putting MDP's post into the format and it seems good. I wonder if Systemkrash has the power to edit it because of his "Hack collaborator" powers, or if we will juggle ownership of the first post. I think the hack collaborator status should allow for mod power in the collaborator extracaganze forum. Either way, I do plan on having a polished OP.
Oh yeah, of course. He can do that.


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