Testing and Development: Deadline-one week after comments

[xjC0n]

@Franky: "a filler level" is mine, yes. I should have mentioned that.

There's still room for improvement though, it always is! ^^

[Awakenyourmind]

@xjC0n:

I personally think you have all you need already. If you change the music and link the upward moving gravity level (3F) to the end of one of your others you could make a nice level. It doesn't need to be amazingly big. The graphics look cool but you should find music to go with them and just mix what you have. A nice level that is done is better then an amazing level that never gets finished.

Put level 3F at the end of your first level and you got a nice level. But don't forget to add music. If you want to use your other levels also you can as well. I wouldn't worry about making the most amazing level ever, just make something fun with what you have, and add on to the fun rooms if you need to, or if they feel to short to you.

[shdwdrgnix]

sorry about that small size( I blame photobucket for that).

heres a bigger image


also I didnt add power ups yet because Im not sure if Demo will be big at the start of all levels.

[Awakenyourmind]

@Capefeather: Your level is fine. No major bugs or glitches. The plants can be annoying, but maybe that's just me. I always have disliked plants that shoot out 2+ fireballs. You should post your level in the level clearing thread.

[ProfessorDemetri]

Franky and Xj: I can't wait to play these when I get home from work! :D

[TaviTurnip]

Franky:

That is really, really difficult. There are a whole bunch of times where thinking fast isn't really enough, and it's more like "guess correctly!" :P Especially at the end after the "HEY THERE raocow!", you have very little time to interpret the coin trail as "run" instead of just "jump off".

Ultimately the level isn't really all that unfair, in the sense that rather than being unable to defeat the challenges, you just have to die/get hit first in order to understand them, which is a lot more doable. Still, it's kind of like playing a miniaturized version of IWBTG, and I like IWBTG and all, and I'm sure that kind of effect is probably what was intended.

Overall, it was totally fun and perfectly put together fine. I just have to wonder if the guesswork isn't a notch too high or anything.

xjC0n:

Hooray it's the outliney textures.

I have to say first off that the level feels really long. Combined with the difficulty of a lot of the maneuvers, it felt like it kind of went on forever and ever. A lot of the jumps took some precision, and it was a lot of precision jumps in a row. There were also a lot of fireballs to get around (And my personal enemy was the Roto-discs, but we can blame that on me personally). Overall I kind of think this level is a bit "too much", but it has the right idea. Also the puzzle area with the ON/OFF switches and the gravity was pretty neat. It was challenging but definitely in the good way. It was probably the most fun part of the whole thing... :P

The level as a whole was constructed perfectly well. I just found that having to learn a jump and then find out that the level just kept going and going was a little much.

As for my own level, uhm, I kind of just got back from the weekend from hell ._. I'd worked on it last week, and I was going to this weekend but then things fell through for about four days in real life. I'm finally free again, though, and I've got Lunar Magic open right now, so that's what's going on now.

[Awakenyourmind]

I've uploaded a video of my level for testers who are having a hard time reaching the end. This video will show you how to deal with a part you may not be able to get past without dieing. This video is unlisted, and it will be removed when my level is inserted to avoid spoiling the level. I just made this for testers to use as a guide so they can complete the level and report back what problems they found, or what can be improved. Criticism is fine, I want to make this level fun for the players, even if that means reducing the difficultly.

Also I will put a gray falling platform at the end since the difficulty is supposed to be over with once you reach the HEY THERE raocow! blocks. (Don't watch until you've played the level!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLpkRAspF8s

[xjC0n]

Thanks for the feedback. It used to be a lot harder actually, I toned it down a bit. I understand what you mean with too long, it's my biggest concern. I have a secret exit anyways, so I intended to split it up, that is what I will do, and I have an idea about where too. I'm gonna think about how I will do this correctly. I want to find a good balance in length and difficulty, so I guess what I have now is good difficulty-wise, but it's too long?

I also need some kind of graphic swaps for some enemies, I have no good ideas right now, but I'll think of something and request it if I can't do it myself. I was thinking about the boo-circle area, however, that whole place might as well be cut out. Even though I kind of like my custom-sprite-edit-thingy.. D:

I got music ported by the awesomest Wyatt, I just need to insert it.. haha

This did get my motivation back.. haha ^^

[ProfessorDemetri]

Home from work, ramen made, pepsi poured, and house coat on, I think I'm about ready to test some game!
*rolls up sleeves*
Writing these as I play 'em.

Franky:

I don't really get why you're giving me a mushroom at the very start, if you're just going to be taking it away from me a few moment later? Why not just start me off as small, as Demo wont be able to bring powerups through from previous levels?
OH DEAR GOD! O_O... so I go up into the pipe and I die, huh? It's literally a second for you to take in the surroundings, and then BOOM, you're dead... I dunno. lol
So I found a few places with cut off.





Also, I found this hilarious. The first time I was confronted with this, I got all nervous, and my brain just went, "STAND IN THE MIDDLE AND HOPE FOR THE BEST!" ...appearently it worked out better then expected lol


FFFUUUUU-!!
What do you mean I was supposed to jump? The coin trail totally threw me for a loop! Damn you deceitful coin trail bastard! >.< But I laughed. lol It still seems like a dick move though.

Okay, so overall, that was a fun, albeit infuriating, level. I had a fun time playing! :) And alot of the obstacles you've set into motion are easily dodge-able... lol
Very cool! I'm happy to have played it!

XJ:

So first thing I notice is the discordance between everything being outlined, and the door being more then just an outline... it looks way outta place here...
Going through the first door, again the 'charlie foot balls' are again suffering from the same problem as the door. So firstly you want me to bounce off the football and then go backwards to make the jump, and then you want another precise jump off of a charlie?

That's asking abit much... And then I died.

Second door: ...WEEEEEE!!!! ^_^
WEEEE!! ....wait...
OH SHIIIIIIIIIIIIITTT!
Dick move man, dick move.

Third door:
The end pipe.... That's mean bro. Cut me deep.


Last section for third door:
So... gravity isn't working, that's neato.
But how the hell do I get past this part?

No really.. lol I have no idea what to do here.

Following the main path:
Okay, that wasn't too bad.

Final consesus:
My god this level is BALL BREAKINGLY HARD. lol It was interesting, and it looked really neato.
But my god, That one part, I couldn't even get past with savestates. I don't even know dude. Might wanna tone it down abit, but that's just my thought. lol

As for my own level, I think the only thing left for me to do is for the music bank to actually work... I don't know how to do that... lol
Welp, this is the latest version, changed the layer priority for the behind cavey bits, yo.

[xjC0n]

Response to ProfessorDemetri's feedback:

The doors are just test doors, never mind them.

First door: The "charlie foot balls" are going to be changed in the game, so I didn't want to bother with the graphics there yet.
That whole area is right after the midpoint, and I already toned that part down, haha. I'll look into it some more, thanks.

Second door: Just my testing area, never mind that.

Third door: That is for the chest, it's all timing, I don't find it incredibly hard, I can edit a bit though.

That place that got you stuck: Throw the shell forward, (down) and jump up before it hits the switches.

Thanks for your input, I'll do some thinking and testing! ^^

Your level will be tested tonight, as I must leave now. Sorry.

[xjC0n]

@ProfessorDemetri:

The level was nice, so I'm just gonna point a few things out.

In the first area, it makes no sense that all stairs are lit up, but the one at the midpoint is special. It would be nice if you get the other stairs to be dark.

In the second area it was hard to tell what coins meant. Sometimes they mean safety, sometimes not, I don't know if that is just a problem for me but it was a little confusing.

The palettes are really neat, I like it.

[TaviTurnip]

ProfessorDemetri:

How wonderfully creepy~

First thing I notice is that Demo's feet pop out underneath the parts where she's behind a rock. Her body also partially shows when she's against a wall/block while behind the rock. It's not something that bothers me, but everybody here seems to hate those kinds of graphic mishaps, so you ought to hear it from them, not me. Also there seems to be more of the same. Koopas' heads seem to show through the ceilings in the brick room.

Props to the sheer number of coins available. I appreciate being able to score over two lives from coins alone without really trying. I like coins >.> Also I like the rather maze-like geography at large. It feels more exploratory and not linear at all. That's a lot of fun.

Also there's slowdown in places, if that ends up being an issue.

Hooray I found the secret exit.

Hooray I found the normal exit right after xD

Ahh that was a lot of fun. Full approval from me. There was nothing too difficult about it, nor could you just breeze through stupidly. It was very well done indeed.

I've been reworking the level from the ground up since last time. All the sublevels are still the same, right now, but I'm doing those as we speak. I'm not really posting this for input as much as I'm simply showing progress. I've got to rework the inner puzzles since one of them's a little breakable. I'm also going to redraw a new graphic for Spiny enemies, since they're kind of a necessary staple of the level, in a sense. You'll see what I mean next time.

http://imageshack.us/m/405/5910/vines2.png

I know it doesn't look like much now. Like I said, I'm just showing progress.

[Diortem]

This is what I got so far. However, I feel that the image doesn't capture the way the level plays properly, but this is a good start for initial feedback. It looks pretty long, but please take in consideration that there's no sublevels, and you start in the center rather than at one end.

Level 136

Initially, I thought of using the spot of the 3-up turnip for the treasure chest, but in that case I'll have to move the coin nearby a bit. That's still something I have to work on.

[Crimson]

I'd been hoping to do more, but life caught up to me:

a2mt2.ips

The first part is the only thing that I'd consider being finished on (Unless it's still considered too annoying), changing the actual rooms is my next job.

[GVirusG]

UPDATE!

Dream I Lost.zip

The level itself is pretty much done.
I need to know whether I should change some things or not and whether this is playable and acceptable as it is.

I'm currently working on ports for my level, so it's gonna get custom music later on.


Yeah, basically posting this because I want to keep my level (especially since it's near completion XP)

[Terry von Feleday]

ProfessorDemitri:

whereami.png

1: There's no real way to see the shell that flies out at you right at the beginning coming the first time you start the level, making it feel like a pointless "gotcha!!" moment. What I would do is put the koopa and the shell above Demo's starting point so the player can see it being kicked, then it turning around and into where they are going won't be quite as much of a surprise. (timing may be tricky on this, but there's probably a way to do it)

2: Similar problem with this grinder. In the first tunnel, I would keep the foreground walls sparse so the player can see that there's a grinder there at all, you still have two more such tunnels to test the player's dodging-invisible-grinders-skill anyway.

3: You should probably put a second P-Switch in this little room or allow another means to escape it, because if the player finds themselves in the situation I created above (one-block hole in the wall above the ground) it can be very annoying to get back out, perhaps even impossible if you made it in there this way while big (by duckjumping).

Other: I felt there's a bit overreliance on the obstacle of two jumping goopas in a narrow hallway. It's tricky the first time you have to get past it, but on subsequent times it just gets a bit annoying.

The spikes in the second segment have an annoying habit of getting lost in the very nice looking, but also very busy background. I know it happened more than once to me that I jumped straight into a spike that I didn't see because I thought it was just part of a platform or the background. Giving them the same bright orange colour as the thwomps and spikeballs (a good choice, by the way) would fix this problem.

The thwomps hidden behind curtains also feel a bit "gotcha"-y. Less so than the shell and grinders, but still a bit irritating. Sometimes there's coins to imply they're there, but there are so many coins in the level that's not really much of a useful metric. Maybe add some background detail to show them being there, like a rip in the curtain showing a bit of the thwomp hiding below, or cracks in the ground where it will land?

I think that's it. Very fun level, I enjoyed it. Nice choice of graphics too, where are they from? The cave part reminds me of ActRaiser.

GVirusG:
I feel a bit stupid for asking this but... How do I get past the gap between the vine and the pipe with a clapping Chuck on it right at the beginning? I feel there's something dumb and obvious I'm missing, but I can't enter the pipe on the far left and I don't see much else that looks like the way forward.

[Gwaur]

asdfadsf

Okay. The thing is, this spring I've been applying to educations. Applying is completely opposite to my nature, so it has drained all my energy. But this project has been on my mind every single day, so it's not like I want to give up my spot. My last entrance exam will be in less than two weeks, and then I'll finally be able to have a summer vacation.

Last time I tried to clear my level, I got positive feedback and also some suggestions, so it's not clear yet. I made some minor modifications according to those suggestions that were mainly to make my background and foreground be connected to each other, both stylistically and physically. Like this:

11f-bg-fg-connectthings.png

I hope posting this won't make me lose my level spot. ;) I'll start to maintain a regular update schedule and make myself stick to it. It'll be two more weeks and then I'm free of this anguish!

[Fireyblaze]

My lack of update is mainly because of my lack of access to a computer. We were moving, and my computer was one of the first things to be packed up. So, I had no access for like 2 weeks. I had just read the PM yesterday because I had school work to make up that was on my computer. I have only gotten like 2 more screens of it done, and I'm debating on whether I should make it a really short level or extend it.

Level024.JPG

The black outlines are sprite only and the white ones are Mario only. Its difficult to understand what is happening without playing, but I'll get a thing for you guys to test later. Should I add the midpoint now and just make it a short stage or add more?

[Awakenyourmind]

The mushroom at the start was just for testing. To show you that you will lose your powerups at the yoshi plants and regain them later. It wont be in the final version. Also the cutoff can't be helped, that's how the person who made the ExGFX did them. Thanks for the feedback guys. I am going to add in another powerup, shorten the end jump, and add some more decorations. I will upload the patch very soon.

[shdwdrgnix]

I changed quite a bit in the first area.


Frozen Mantis


Also an ips link for those that want to play it.

Frozen Mantis ips

Also note that I am still looking for the right music for the first area, any help would be appreciated.

I will finish up whats left of area 2 shortly.

[raocow]

if you are really, really hurtin' for some music, ask chronium to compose you something, or look around the composed pieces of music, and all that.

[Awakenyourmind]

I've fixed the end jump. Added in two more extra powerups (spread out) and I am re doing the whole first level. It will be a castle part just like this one, however it will be different. It wont be a line guided section. So far it's coming along good. I will update this post soon.

[ProfessorDemetri]

xj: good point about the stairs. I never really thought that hard about it... I'll look into it... I doubt I'll be able to change it, as changing the palette would also change the purple color of the around-y bits too... hmm.. Maybe I'll make the message read as something different. Thank you

Rena: Fucking layer priority is ALWAYS busting my ass lol. I'm running out of map16 slots maaaaaaaan, geeeeez. But you're totally right lol. FoD would probably say the same thing, so I might as well bite this one in the butt now, rather then later. Thank you for the kind words lol

Terry: Or maaaaaaybe, add another koopa above demo, so that she's always cautious from the get go? I like that plan better. Both of us are right lol. Your second point is totally right, I'll change that. Your third point, I don't honestly see the need. I mean, I'm okay with annoying the player for making a 1 box hole for themselves, and if they need to crouch jump for 10 seconds, then so be it. I'm okay with that lol. You're right about the koopas, and the spike palette. I'll change those. I actually like the surprise of the thwomps, though. Makes you feel paranoid, and that you can't trust the guidance of the coins, or what you previously thought. That's the overall point of this level. And actually, the tileset is from Demon's Crest, for the cave, and Ardy Lightfoot for the castle bit. Man, them SNES games. Nostalgia all up in here lol Thanks for the input!

Thanks for the input, guise!
As much as I'd like to do everything you guys tell me, I am going to have to pull rank on my own level, and go with my gut for a few things, but I thank you for all the input! :)

[GVirusG]

@Terry von Feleday

Yeah, that's one of the few tough jumps in my level. There should be a koopa and a goopa around, so just try throwing these at the chuck. If you miss or if you can't hit him, try finding the right spot and the right time to jump.
That's all there is to it

[Karatekid5]

I saw the heads up video, and even though I haven't posted since May 6th, I'm still making progress on the level. Though in the past two weeks, I was pretty busy with a lifeguarding class and removing a computer virus, so I just wanted to explain the absence, and I will have some progress posted by the end of the weekend. I'll also post the resources I used so far since the CMS has to be re-updated.