ASMT v2.0

[raocow]

There's no shell jumping man, if you're talking about the icey cave in world 3 you're supposed to throw up the shell where there's a collumn of coins to knock down a springboard.

[yoshicookiezeus]

So...

So I got reminded that I had a boss for SMWCP2 I was supposed to code, and I thought it would be a good idea to get that done first. Add to that getting distracted by getting Skyward Sword for Christmas and a bit of my usual procrastination, and you get the reason there haven't been much activity on this front lately.

Anyway, yesterday I was thinking a bit about the teleporter rooms in Trial of Iron. Since the Metroid boss honestly isn't all that great, and chdata's control scrambling gimmick, though executed horribly, seems like it could be rather neat if done better, I'm considering removing the Metroid room entirely and replacing it with a simple and not too long obstacle course using the control scrambling. Opinions?

(and on the same note, the Yoshizilla room will be redesigned completely, most likely with more of a focus on spinjumping on buildings and less on spikes and homing bullets everywhere)

[Alex-R]

There's no shell jumping man, if you're talking about the icey cave in world 3 you're supposed to throw up the shell where there's a collumn of coins to knock down a springboard.

That level is still pretty crap anyway. I'm not sure if it's actually salvagable or not but here are some changes I guess we (or I) could make:

Some Sort Of Place Type Object:

- Fix entrance camera position

- Change the FG palette to make it look more like ice. Some people apparently got confused (?).

- Make the level a lot more maneuverable in general (mostly first half).

- Fix some semi blind jumps.

- Make the first two koopa hopping segments flow a bit better. I thinking of adding some ledges instead of some of the koopas.

- Coin arrow instead of column to make the location of the springbaord more obvious.

- Make backtracking to springboard easier.

- Add a reset door for the springboard/blue koopa 'puzzles'.

- Remove/replace the Lakitu cloud sublevel (39) with something else. It doesn't feel like it belongs there, especially since there's already a Lakitu cloud level right before this one.

- If we decide to not remove/replace said sublevel, at the very least change munchers to spikes to make it look less ugly.

- Add another powerup somewhere in the second half?

- Make it easier to get on top of the springboard in the second half.

- Move last Dragon coin.

These are just some very easy fixes to make it less crap, since I don't know how much you intend to change the levels.

By the way, are you planning on doing any changes to the OW at all? The flying level should probably be optional. I guess it could change places with "Charlie's Outhouse"? (unless starting a world with a Ghost House is weird?)

[raekuul]

Fly Sky High is doable (moreso since I of all people can do the regular path with some degree of ease); the only real problem with starting World 3's submap with it is you have to play Noah's Argh over if you get a Game Over (and the next save point is on the harder exit of FSH). If you ask me, just switch around "On Cloud Nine" with "Charlie's Outhouse"

EDIT: I discovered something interesting during Booster Dump Site just now. Apparently my keyboard can't do three buttons at once >.< Made that level a lot more difficult when I grabbed the Booster Controller.

EDIT 2: And by switch around, just change which exit goes to which one.

[Alex-R]

Fly Sky High is doable (moreso since I of all people can do the regular path with some degree of ease); the only real problem with starting World 3's submap with it is you have to play Noah's Argh over if you get a Game Over (and the next save point is on the harder exit of FSH).

Well, I was thinking about the fact that quite a few people, according to feedback atleast, just kind of dislike flying levels in general. It just seems a bit silly to force them to play one when it's easily avoided.

[raekuul]

The problem with SMW-style flight is that it turns into a Momentum Puzzle. The regular exit is easy enough to get to (meaning you'll be replaying Noah's Argh maybe once before you get the hang of it), while the key is after a major momentum puzzle. If it wasn't for the fact that the next Save Point is after the Key Exit in that level, it would be tolerable.

[Chdata]

I approve of whatever is going to be done with Yoshizilla.

Also, I think I asked you to do this for the Guts Tank level except it never really happened.

STZ $19 in the levelinitcode for the Guts Tank chase.

Demo has a much easier time in that level if she's forced to be small. It's how I tested the level.

This is because the speedboosting blocks are only a one block layer, or only 16x16. If Demo is two blocks tall, the upper half of her isn't speedboosted or something and basically you are almost certain to get screwed if you're not small Demo compared to being small Demo where it isn't nearly as bad.

Also, replace the song with the origional version (one of the more 8bit ones). It really fits better.

If you can't find it I should have it somewhere, send a pm.

p.s. a version of ASMT with raocow's origionial graphics ;o

[Argumentable]

Pretty sure it's cause small mario runs slightly faster in general

[Chdata]

I thought both can achieve the same speeds

[yoshicookiezeus]

In any case, ever since the public release Demo's powerup status is reset when entering the teleporter hub, so she can never get into the Gutsdozer room big.

[Chdata]

sweet

[gamercal]

So did this die out completely, never to be revived? Shame, I was looking forward to playing this updated version :(

[raocow]

yeah, if iyou where going to wait to lp asmt... I don't think we can really 'count' on an official release date any time soon.

[Giant Ninji]

So did this die out completely, never to be revived? Shame, I was looking forward to playing this updated version :(

YCZ is trying to get one of the SMWCP2 bosses done, which he promised to finished quite a while ago. The most that this project's status is "on hold".

[yoshicookiezeus]

Might as well put this here too:

ASMT v1.2

Changelog:
- world 3 Lakitu boss should no longer break in emulators that aren't ZSNES
- cutscenes are now skippable by pressing Start

Credit goes to Alex for reminding me that this thing exists and for helping fix the Lakitu boss.


(no, this doesn't mean that I'm reviving this project just yet; I still have my SMWCP boss and my overworld contest entry to finish)

[Jesuiscontent]

Changelog:
- world 3 Lakitu boss should no longer break in emulators that aren't ZSNES

Wooooo
This alone makes this update worth it, good job !

[Argumentable]

I still have my SMWCP boss

Didn't you say that 6 months ago

[yoshicookiezeus]

Didn't you say that 6 months ago

...indeed. I just so happen to be a rather terrible procrastinator ._.

[kil3]

The hell was breaking the lakitu boss anyway?

[kil3]

haha that's terrible

[gamercal]

I found in testing the original version over ZSNES netplay that it doesn#t exactly work, haha. The second player can't spin jump for some reason, and the demo counter is predictably fucked over. I have no idea on either counts though why it happens, cause it doesn't in local play.

I suspect it's something to do with ZSNES (cause seriously, why wouldn't it be?), especially since their netplay was abandoned after 1.42. Ah well, I doubt it can be fixed, but it IS strange that this is the only hack I have played which has this issue... well, there goes my ideas for LP'ing this. Too bad.

[Wyatt]

it doesn't in local play.

You sure? 'Cause I just tried local play on zsnes 1.51 and player 2 can't spinjump there either. Thanks for bringing this up though, now it's way more likely that it'll get fixed!

Also, while I'm here: I edited a bunch of the levels (I stopped at Wild Green Yonder I think), fixing simple stuff such as making On Cloud Nine impossible to go under. I did this over a month ago so it's all done on ASMT v1. There's also a bug where the music cuts out if it's not supposed to change between sublevels. There's a text file of changes that still needed to be done, so comparing that with the first post will show what I've changed. I hope you can use this, YCZ!

[gamercal]

That's interesting. It didn't for me in 1.42 local play. I think I had the same controller working for both players, so MAYBE it's possible that it is that. I really have no idea, but if it is remotely fixable then I'll be super happy!

[AxemJinx]

I suppose this is the best place to post this.

I finished playing ASMT recently, and I thought I'd try remodeling some levels when I'm in the mood, to make them more playable, polished, etc. This doesn't really have any official support- it's just me tinkering around with the version hosted on smwc (1.1), basically.

Anyway, I worked on almost half of And So It Began today, so if you'd like to provide any feedback on the direction I'm taking with it, there's an IPS here. (It's not really version 2.0 yet- it's just how I'm naming it.) It's based on v1.1, so the save file in this thread should still work if you don't have one (though I don't know if the yoshi coins will be there).

I realize I might get some "don't fix what ain't broke" comments here, but to me, the original level didn't really feel like a beach, plus the landscaping was kind of lazy, so I wanted to try reinterpreting it. Still a WIP, of course, and I haven't touched the bonus room yet.

[Alex-R]

Stuff...

Hmm, interesting that you decided to start with this of all levels. Apart from the vine jumping in the beginning and a few other things, this is one of the few levels that I don't think there was that much wrong with. Nothing outstanding, but a fairly solid first level that does what it's supposed to. I realize that this sound just like "don't fix what ain't broke", but misunderstand me correctly now; I like the initiative, I'm just not too sure you're actually improving on the source material in this one case. There are plenty of other levels desperately in need of a makeover, however.

Some thoughts in regards to your version:

If you were going for a more beachy feeling, might I ask why you decided to have all those wines and ceilings everywhere? It gives me the exact opposite feeling. The level feels a lot more closed off now, kind of cave-like. The problem here, I think, is that throughout basically the entire section you've done so far, the player can constantly see some vines/coins/Parakoopas or whatever above them. For being the first stage of a game I think this could be a tad overwhelming and confusing. That one coin trail near the first Chuck being the worst offender. I get that it is like that to make the player want to get up there, but still. I think a more straightforward approach to this level would be for the better.

If you want to make the level seem more like a beach, might I suggest opening the level up more by spacing out the floating landmasses more (if you decide to keep them, that is)? When I think of beach levels, I think of open areas with little or very gradual vertical movement, instead of having to climb big landmasses, like you have to do in your version to get all those goodies.

Speaking of, I would also like to point out that the way you hid the dragon coins might not be the most intuitive way of going about it, assuming the player has never touched a Mario game before this. (Yes, I know, this is the exact opposite attitude of the current version of ASMT, but the entire point of this is to change it for the better, right?). In the original version, if I remember correctly, the dragon coins were mostly placed in a way so the player is almost guaranteed to collect them, which is, I think, a better way of doing it. Don't bother hiding them until later in the game, when the player has figured out that collecting all five of them in a single level leads to happiness and glory.

Also, you should probably fix that one jump where the second shell-less koopa is. You tend to get stuck on the slope sometimes.