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Planning/Plot Thread

Revolution, the only solution, the armed response of an entire nation.

This is an RPG.
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Clamestarebla
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Re: Planning/Plot Thread

Post by Clamestarebla »

Plot download is now in the OP.
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Re: Planning/Plot Thread

Post by swirlybomb »

Hey there!

I'm really super-duper sorry about never getting back to you after you sent me your plot writeup... Entirely my fault.

As a whole, I think the plot's pretty good, but I think the endgame could probably use a bit of tinkering;
I think the thing that sticks out the most to me would be the party facing raocow in chapter 9 and him being far too powerful to handle, but then two chapters later in the finale, he's expected to be defeated. Is there something that happens to 'weaken' raocow somehow/make him vulnerable?
Where exactly does Ezenen/SNN's allegiance lie? He's seen alongside raocow in chapter 8, but wouldn't he technically be a Lunarian (who attacks Talkhausbourg in chapter 10)? He's not listed in the teams/allegiances list at the bottom.
Additionally, rather than having a seven(!?)-part final chapter with all of the bosses (that is, raocow's generals and the leaders of Natural Causes) being faced in a row, it'd probably be much better to split them up more and have them be more-gradually taken out during the game. Perhaps 'Team raocow' starts being actually fought from chapter 8 onward, with one or two of them appearing as the boss(es) of each chapter. (For that matter, Drift isn't mentioned at all after chapter 8, unless he would be a boss of one of the following chapters)

Speaking of bosses, it'd be a good idea to plan out who exactly the bosses are for each chapter of the rest of the game; Blake The S/Black DS is the boss of chapter 2, of course (and perhaps Demo is technically the boss of chapter 3, but raocow is the one to actually deal with her anyway), and I don't think the others should be TOO hard to puzzle out (actually I suppose about half of them are more or less obvious already). Doesn't necessarily need to be done IMMEDIATELY, but it should be done at some point, of course - I'm just putting it out there.
Some other things that come to mind...
How exactly does the 'tactician' factor in to the story? Is s/he going to be the 'main character'/Lord-analogue, or just kind of a joke that appears near the beginning but then nobody cares about them anymore after? If they're not the 'main character', then an actual protagonist would have to be decided on somehow. In Clem's test videos of his Prologue map, the 'tactician' is a mageguy, would could work (although apparently it may be possible to make a unit that can use both weapons and magic? so that could potentially be an option too, if people wanted it). S/he's also apparently from Trimoon, which isn't referred to anywhere else in the plot (not yet, at least); I assume that's the joke, that it's brought up but nobody cares, but I figure I should ask in case it's actually meant to be plot-relevant in some way.

Also, at this point it seems that Horikawa is with the party from the prologue up until chapter 5 when she gets 'kidnapped', then isn't seen again until chapter 8 where she's revealed as one of raocow's associates, and fought during the finale (in the current plot, at least). So she should be the obvious Jeigan archetype, right? Except that rather than becoming less-useful later, she leaves the party permanently? (For those not 'in the know', the Jeigan archetype is a powerful unit that joins you at the beginning of the game and is far stronger than any of your 'normal' units; but since they're already in a promoted class, they'll earn far less experience from combat that would be better spent training your normal units, and they tend to 'fall off' in usefulness after the first few chapters or so) What about making her re-recruitable near the end of the game, to get her back on your team and making it so that any time spent using her isn't completely wasted?

What exactly happens in chapter 5? Do you fight the Tyrants and their 'army', and then fight Natural Causes afterward? The way it's written, it sounds like the party confronts Natural Causes, NC tells them that they don't have Horikawa, and then the party just leaves. Neither way seems all that 'plausible' to me (chapters don't usually have two whole maps attached to them... and the lack of confrontation in the latter doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me, unless that's the entire joke, like "Oh, sorry to trouble you, we'll just be on our way then").

For chapter 6 where you fight the Evil Team Of Pure Chaos, there's quite a few names listed under that team, for antagonists that are only faced in a single chapter. Named units are usually either bosses or recruitable people, so I just wonder if it should be less people or if it's fine the way it is.

This is just my own opinion, but I think that it would be cooler if Hell was replaced with, say, Luna Tower (which was present in Isieri's plot draft and I thought was a cool idea) or even Zebraspace. Like, instead of a portal to Hell, it's the Luna Tower that was secretly being constructed or something. Just feels like it'd make for a better fit, but I don't know if anyone else would agree with me.

I notice that there are no 'gaiden chapters' for Pholtos to appear in here, but admittedly gaiden chapters should probably be 'extra credit' material once the rest of the game has been done.
Hope I'm not, like, being too nitpicky or anything about all this! I do think most of it is pretty good, just needs a little ironing out is all. Definitely wish to hear others' thoughts about things as well...!
anonymousbl00dlust wrote:All the obstacles in my level can be beaten on the players first attempt without any 'future predicting'.
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Re: Planning/Plot Thread

Post by TheFinalSentinel »

swirlybomb wrote:A whole lot of stuff.
I'm pretty sure Tatics Man got his neck sliced by Horikawa.

Also, I really like the idea of Zebraspace over Hell. I second that; Hell is so boring and cliché. Image
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Re: Planning/Plot Thread

Post by Clamestarebla »

I like the Luna Tower Zebraspace idea, would probably work better for a gauntlet type of fight.
I think the thing that sticks out the most to me would be the party facing raocow in chapter 9 and him being far too powerful to handle, but then two chapters later in the finale, he's expected to be defeated. Is there something that happens to 'weaken' raocow somehow/make him vulnerable?
It could be just as simple as the Revolution thinking that if they defeat every single one of his henchmen, he could then be defeated. This sort of thing could be expanded upon once the game gets more chapters.
Where exactly does Ezenen/SNN's allegiance lie? He's seen alongside raocow in chapter 8, but wouldn't he technically be a Lunarian (who attacks Talkhausbourg in chapter 10)? He's not listed in the teams/allegiances list at the bottom.
Whoops, forgot to put him in Team raocow. Pretty sure it was explained in a previous document but I forgot to write it again. SNN basically aids raocow in becoming the supreme master of everything by making the Lunarians and Talkhausers fight. They overpower the Hausers at first, raocow introduces the Talkhaus Anthem to boost the Hauser's morale and then the Lunarians lose on purpose so that the Hausers love raocow more.
Speaking of bosses, it'd be a good idea to plan out who exactly the bosses are for each chapter of the rest of the game
Chapter 1: Some SMBX guy
Chapter 2: BlackDS
Chapter 3: No boss, survive
Chapter 4: Some SMWC guy
Chapter 5 part 1: Tyrants
part 2: Survive or a slightly more powerful NC
Chapter 6: Team Chaos
Chapter 7: Drift
Chapter 8: I have a good idea for this one
Chapter 9: Thissa and Brake (forgot to add him (dang it me))
Chapter 10: Survive
Chapter 11: Everyone
Now to put you in perspective, that's what the boss spread would look like with the additional chapters:
Chapter 1: SMBX guy
Chapter 2: BlackDS
Chapter 3: Survival
Chapter 3X: Pholtos
Chapter 4: SMWC guy
Chapter 5 part 1: Tyrants
part 2: NC
Chapter 6: Team Chaos
Chapter 7: Drift
Chapter 8: The good idea
Chapter 8X**: Tyrants
Chapter 8XX**: Pholtos
Chapter 9: Thissa and Brake
Chapter 9X: Limepie and Jesuis
Chapter 10: Survive
Chapter 10X: SNN
Chapter 10XX: Rena
Chapter 11: Everyone*
*If you defeated Limepie, Jesuis and Rena in the optional chapters, they won't show up.
**Not really an additional chapter, but more of an extra part that can be unlocked.
What about making her re-recruitable near the end of the game, to get her back on your team and making it so that any time spent using her isn't completely wasted?
Approved.
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Re: Planning/Plot Thread

Post by swirlybomb »

Mmmight be too many extra chapters going on there? But I guess we'll see what happens.

How about the 'Tactician'/player character, what's their deal?

Also, it's occurred to me that Alex and Bwarch ragequit at some point; are they still kosher for being in the game...?
anonymousbl00dlust wrote:All the obstacles in my level can be beaten on the players first attempt without any 'future predicting'.
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Re: Planning/Plot Thread

Post by Clamestarebla »

swirlybomb wrote: How about the 'Tactician'/player character, what's their deal?
Could make a very sub-par character with not much going for him.
Also, it's occurred to me that Alex and Bwarch ragequit at some point; are they still kosher for being in the game...?
Alex doesn't care anyways except when it comes to saying stuff that he pretends that Limepie told him to tell me. Anyways, he was planned to be in long before he was banned. If Bwarch doesn't want to be in he can just tell me on Skype and we haven't talked about that ever so...
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Re: Planning/Plot Thread

Post by swirlybomb »

I mean, what's their (that is, Tactician/player) relevance to the story, I guess? Are they the 'main protagonist' who's critical to playing the game because if they die, it's game over? Story-wise I think having an 'outsider' protagonist works so that no one Talkhauser gets to be the main hero of the game. Though if all the other characters just kind of pay them no mind and don't care much about what they have to say, then it's hard to justify them being critical to the plot/game...
anonymousbl00dlust wrote:All the obstacles in my level can be beaten on the players first attempt without any 'future predicting'.
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