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Superb Demo Sisters Enters Genesis

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WestonSmith
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Superb Demo Sisters Enters Genesis

Post by WestonSmith »

Superb Demo Sisters Genesis Version

Last Updated: October 12/2014

What's New?
!---SUPERB DEMO SISTERS---!
-Added newest Hard Mode updates
-Minor HUB updates (namely to author room)
-Hard Mode is now properly listed in the files and linked to the HUB
-Includes all updates from Version Foxtrot
What's on the Docket?
-Hard Mode Finalization
-Linking credits
-Minus World
Last edited by WestonSmith 9 years ago, edited 10 times in total.
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Grounder
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Grounder »

Before I download and test, is it a standalone .EXE, and does it come with Luna.DLL?
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I am perfectly tasty...

AND I'LL STEAL YOUR SOUL! :twisted:

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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by WestonSmith »

Comes with the proper LunaDLL, but it does not include the .exe.
Swap the included LunaDLL with the one included with A2MBXT. DO NOT GET RID OF THE OLD ONE; JUST MOVE IT INTO A FOLDER. IT IS STILL NEEDED FOR A2MBXT!!!

Hold that clears things up.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Compound Fraxure »

My level in the alpha is actually the first draft of my level. I must have sent you that on accident.
This is the final version:
https://www.mediafire.com/?eccb94e1qxc88l1
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Their tusks can shatter rocks. Since a broken tusk will not grow back, they diligently sharpen their tusks on river rocks after they've been fighting. Territory battles between [name omitted] can be intensely violent.
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Axon
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Axon »

So I just beat the main game.

Stuff I noticed:
- It's possible to move a springboard slightly before you drop it.
- I'm not sure about the current night music. I feel that "M. Gorge" would be a slightly better choice.
- Some levels have invisible blocks after the flag, some don't.
4-2: Level has slopes (not a problem?)
4-4: Feels like a sudden jump in difficulty, probably in part because of all the weirdly synchronized firebars. (might even be harder than 7-4)
5-3: Music doesn't stop when you reach the flag. (might be caused by the "musictrigger" event)
5-4 (and other castles?): Bowser's fireballs don't despawn when you get the axe
6-2: There's a sign that tells about a vine or something. Also, level has slopes (not a problem?)
6-4 and 7-4: Bowser doesn't breathe fire?
8-2: Caterpillars don't despawn when you reach the flag.
8-4: Mushroom can fall into lava (could also be possible in other castles too)

In other news, world 9 is destroying my face.
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Mabel
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Mabel »

Looks like I need to update 8-4 anyways since sometimes the other exit that shoulda been removed stops you from getting the leek, which ends the game and leaves you leekless :<
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WestonSmith
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by WestonSmith »

Axon wrote:So I just beat the main game.

Stuff I noticed:
- It's possible to move a springboard slightly before you drop it.
- I'm not sure about the current night music. I feel that "M. Gorge" would be a slightly better choice.
- Some levels have invisible blocks after the flag, some don't.
4-2: Level has slopes (not a problem?)
4-4: Feels like a sudden jump in difficulty, probably in part because of all the weirdly synchronized firebars. (might even be harder than 7-4)
5-3: Music doesn't stop when you reach the flag. (might be caused by the "musictrigger" event)
5-4 (and other castles?): Bowser's fireballs don't despawn when you get the axe
6-2: There's a sign that tells about a vine or something. Also, level has slopes (not a problem?)
6-4 and 7-4: Bowser doesn't breathe fire?
8-2: Caterpillars don't despawn when you reach the flag.
8-4: Mushroom can fall into lava (could also be possible in other castles too)

In other news, world 9 is destroying my face.
In order:
-Springboard shouldn't be grabbable at all. Might be missing NPC-Flags somewhere.
-I'm not sure on the Night music either. I'll look at M. Gorge tomorrow.
-If its a looping event level, the invisible blocks are necessary. The rest only need them up high. I thought I got all of them, but I'll have another look.
-Slopes are an issue, but though 6-2 is an exception. Missed fixing the ones in 4-2.
-4-4 and 7-4 are likely to have some pretty big changes.
-I'll fix 5-3's music.
-Must've missed 5-4. Will fix.
-I thought I took that sign out. Will fix.
-Bowser's fire was removed to reflect the original game. Bowser loses fire in those worlds, and picks up hammers instead. Only 8-4 featured both.
-Yeah, caterpillars are a problem. They don't seem to respond to hiding the Spawned NPC layer.
-Can't say I ever had the game crash due to mushrooms and lava, so I never thought about it during testing. Should I change this? Its in most castles.

And yes, World 9 is harsh. Might increase the starting lives or else start adding 1-Ups to the levels (only 9-7 has any, I think).
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Axon
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Axon »

WestonSmith wrote: -Can't say I ever had the game crash due to mushrooms and lava, so I never thought about it during testing. Should I change this? Its in most castles.
Personally, the error has only happened to me when the mushroom was offscreen when it touched the lava.

Also, 0-1's custom music loops really badly. (by the way, can that level be accessed in-game?)
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by WestonSmith »

Nah, 0-1 isn't in the game yet.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Kil »

The old .exe is not needed for a2mbxt by the way. At least I don't know why it would be. Is it because of the built in music or something?
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Doctor Shemp »

I've reviewed the first three worlds in video form. I've tried to be a lot more critical than in my A2XT videos since the levels here have to be judged on their intended purpose as well as whether they work. I've given short descriptions but I recommend you watch the video to get my full meaning.
Colour code:
No recommendations
Some recommendations
Many and/or serious recommendations
Buggy

HUB:
Typos.
1-1 (Clemasterable)
The first blocks should be raised. The furba inside the first jump between blocks should be removed. The first and third goopa sections should be swapped.
1-2 (Leet)
A bonus area should be added. The first elevator should be followed by solid ground rather than asking the player to chain together elevator jumps immediately.
1-3 (Doctor Shemp)
I can't fairly test this.
1-4 (Weston Smith)
Some of the firebars make this too hard for 1-4.
2-1 (LitDude42)
The springboards can be grabbed for a single frame.
2-2 (Clemasterable)
Boxes on high optional platforms should give more rewards than coins.
2-3 (Swirlybomb)
Raise the first ? block to reinforce that the player now has infinite jumps.
2-4 (Luigiman09)
Remove the podoboos from the start of the boss platform.
3-1 (Heavy Sigh)
This level's meant to introduce bananasnakes. It needs more than just one token banansnake right at the end.
3-2 (Monkeyshrapnel)
This level is too flat, too long, way too repetitive and just irrepressibly drab and awful.
3-3 (Holy)
This level's too easy for its placement. Considering that we're short on banansnakes at this point, try adding one or two.
3-4 (Quantumphysicsman)
Remove the one-tile jump, even if it is optional. Once again, considering that we're short on banansnakes at this point, try adding one (but not much more than that or it'll be too hard for 3-4). Best just to stick with one.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by KingTwelveSixteen »

You can briefly pick up shells when holding run, resulting in the shell getting kicked from higher up and no bounce.

3-3's first powerup is a beet, not a cactus.

Also 1-4 is too hard for world 1. There are long jumps over lava with a nearby ceiling! Also firebars which are in pretty tricky places to avoid.

3-4 has cutoff with the first firebar going behind the lava. Also it has beets which could fall into lava I guess.

I accidentally skipped 4-3 and 4-4 because of the warp zone. :(

5-2's secret underwater portion has a squid that makes it very difficult to grab the powerup at the start, and nothing else difficult in that portion.
Also the catfish don't pass through walls like the ones in the first underwater bit do.

5-3 briefly after the level start (while jumping onto the first moving platforms) the music 'skipped' a bit, restarting. The music also does not stop when you beat the level.

5-4 fireballs don't disappear when boss is defeated. IE, fallen into the lava.


6-2...It's KingTwelveSIXTEEN. Not seventeen.

7-2 there's an/several invisible blocks stopping you from grabbing the very top of the flagpole. :(

7-3 the bridge supports don't go the proper three blocks down from the bottom of the screen, allowing for slight weirdness.


8-1 I don't think I got a single powerup that whole level. I was looking for one the whole time, and that one was pretty long!
8-2 aaaah, feels like a welcome relief. Two powerups and a short level. Feels great after the previous one.
If you want that kind of reaction for the player you can keep it in.

8-4 touching the ax doesn't make the bananas dissappear, but it does appear to remove the boss himself. Without letting him fall to hit the lava. Odd.
...When I won the level and talked to the guy (while I was small), it made me complete the level...without me touching the leek. It auto-won using the standard SMB3 roulette thing or whatever and I didn't get to grab it. :(
Now that's just unfair.
Last edited by KingTwelveSixteen 10 years ago, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Kil »

Some things I'm noticing

The warp zone pipes are not labeled. Was someone planning to do this? If someone can tell me all the levels that have warp pipes I could make appear exactly as in smb1 with lunadll scripting
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by WestonSmith »

Thanks for all the bugs/issues/recommendations so far. I'll be touching things up tonight.

As for Warp Zones, 4-2 has the graphics for them. I haven't bothered with 1-2 however. I'll add them soon-ish.

EDIT: In case level authors are wondering, I am updating levels myself. If you would like to make changes to your level based on the feedback here, let me know, cause there's no point in both of us making the same changes. Thanks!
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by glitch4 »

Some authors in hub are empty. Can they still send their information there?
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WestonSmith
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by WestonSmith »

LitDude42 wrote:Some authors in hub are empty. Can they still send their information there?
Yes sir. Just PM me and I'll add the text/graphics later on.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Grounder »

Early castles at the very least are uncompletable as Iris, as the warp is too far to the right for her to reach before the SMB3 gate causes the level to "end", returning her to the hub/start screen. The warp needs to be moved left.

EDIT: With some hard-fixes on my end, yes every level from 1-1 to 8-4 is technically winnable.

Suggestions/gripes:

4-1: Two Lakitus at the end is a bit much, I think.

4-4: Final two Firebars don't seems possible to clear without tanking a hit.

5-1(?): Those last two Paragoopas are horribly positioned, they're cheap kills for the player, ditch them.

8-2: Strongly suggest either removing the Latiku or some of the Banana Snakes. Together with the way he stage is laid out, it's an extremely frustrating level that's disproportional to both the surrounding levels, and indeed most of he game.
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I am perfectly tasty...

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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Beta

Post by WestonSmith »

Posted an updated version.

Haven't played a full run yet. 4-2 is a new version completely, so hopefully it's linked correctly without issue. Does not include Grounder's suggested changes, will impliment those later on.

EDIT: Just tested it. Seems to link fine.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by Doctor Shemp »

Grounder wrote:4-1: Two Lakitus at the end is a bit much, I think.
There shouldn't be two lakitus simultaneously. The second lakitu is on a layer that only appears when the first lakitu dies. Are you sure that they were both there simultaneously and you didn't just kill the first one only to have the second one appear just after?
Grounder wrote:8-2: Strongly suggest either removing the Latiku or some of the Banana Snakes. Together with the way he stage is laid out, it's an extremely frustrating level that's disproportional to both the surrounding levels, and indeed most of he game.
Well that's certainly different from KingTwelveSixteen who said it was much easier than the surrounding levels. I'm not especially happy with the level either but given how completely different your two opinions are, can I ask for a third opinion? Because I don't want to make it easier if it's already too easy or make it harder if it's already too hard. I think it's very hard but then again I find Worlds 5 and 6 hard (just finished World 6 earlier. I'll have a video up later. It has the old version of 4-2 though).
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Beta

Post by Grounder »

They were both there at once.

It probably only happened once, though.
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I am perfectly tasty...

AND I'LL STEAL YOUR SOUL! :twisted:

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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Beta

Post by Doctor Shemp »

Then I have no idea what could have caused that.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Beta

Post by Mabel »

Doctor Shemp wrote:Then I have no idea what could have caused that.
It happened to me as well. Maybe a layer isn't hidden or something
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Beta

Post by Doctor Shemp »

I think I figured out the cause: rather than Lakitu 2 being hidden by default he's set to be hidden by the Level Start event. This lvl file changes that so that he's hidden by default.
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Alpha

Post by swirlybomb »

Doctor Shemp wrote:2-2 (Clemasterable)
Boxes on high optional platforms should give more rewards than coins.
2-3 (Swirlybomb)
Raise the first ? block to reinforce that the player now has infinite jumps.
I think you mixed these up : P
I can concede to offering a 'bigger' reward if it seems necessary, but I feel like a Free Life is too much for making one jump, and to me, coins are theoretically a 'suitable' reward for people that will actually be playing the game without a 99 lives cheat. (I do believe the stated intention for coins/lives was theoretically "don't go overboard, think like SMB1" which more or less means "not all that many" in theory)
Grounder wrote:Early castles at the very least are uncompletable as Iris, as the warp is too far to the right for her to reach before the SMB3 gate causes the level to "end", returning her to the hub/start screen. The warp needs to be moved left.
Is that the problem? I was playing with Iris specifically because I never tested anything with her, and was seriously wondering why each castle booted me back to the 'title screen' when it didn't seem to happen for Shemp or anyone else (or else they would've mentioned it).


Also... why did the "night" music get changed to SMW Boss? It was Seaside Town since the 'beginning', and I think it's really fitting so I don't know why it's different.


After watching Shemp's video, I mostly agree with just about everything he said.
Haphazard notes from my not-super-thorough playing earlier:
1-1 I think should have invisible 1-up in the center of the

Code: Select all

  ?   _   ?
X   X   X   X
block formation (with the _ being where I think it should go), nicely 'rewards' the player for being 'clever'; vine still seems super out of place because it's the only vine in the game that doesn't lead to Coin Heaven

1-2 doesn't have invisible blocks to prevent jumping over the flagpole; blocks at right side of Warp Zone should be higher to prevent being jumped on
---Iris can easily jump over the ceiling where the unique brick formation/second powerup is, think it should be intentional 'secret'

1-4 should have less firebars, and most should be going the opposite direction to make it easier; tricky low-ceiling jump near end (esp. with Iris?)

***consistency: 'death' water should be light blue, 'swimming' water should be dark blue

2-4 (never saw this one before!) has a one-block gap that can be duck-jumped into; enemy spam (Podoboos)

3-1 has a much-too-large pit, I thought that was already 'fixed' beforehand?; could some of the bricks in the latter half be changed to ? blocks for variance's sake?

3-2 is way too long and boring, and a very easy life-farm
---since 3-1 also 'introduces' slipperyness/ice physics, perhaps 3-2 should be the 'introduction to Hammer Bros' instead

3-3 (never saw this one before?) second 'pulley' platforms are illogical (first platform is much lower than second making it very easy to get stuck) (4-3 seems to 'introduce' them better??); very large jump near the middle; doesn't have any 'falling' platforms?

3-4 too many Podoboos?
---both 2-4 and 3-4: spots with multiple Podoboos should really be cut down to just one; it's the exact same hazard, but looks a lot more spammy

4-2 not much time to react to first Buzzy Beetle, and too big first pit? got Kaizo-killed by invisible block (that leads to 1-up up above)

4-4 is REALLY challenging, enemy spam-y and claustrophic; attempting to make it a maze too would be unreasonable (if the maze is still planned, 90% of the enemies should be removed); springboards are unncecessary because that jump is doable from the ground

5-1 still not really a fan of that whole ending segment, it's super-easy for something to go wrong (especially with ice physics)

5-2 overhanging wall near end (with elevator platforms) is unncessarily 'tricky'; underwater part's first Blooper is hard to deal with to get powerup; could easily reduce # of coins in multi-coin blocks

5-3 music issues have already been mentioned

5-4 'bouncing' (not holding the run button) on the first red Koopa to get the powerup almost certainly kills you, because you don't land soon enough to jump over it; Koopas get really enemy spam-y; falling platforms essentially get 'introduced' here very suddenly because they haven't appeared yet (since they're 'supposed' to be in 3-3 but aren't)
Some of this may be obsolete due to the update.
When I inserted/altered 4-2 myself, suddenly I could hold shells again? Not sure why.
anonymousbl00dlust wrote:All the obstacles in my level can be beaten on the players first attempt without any 'future predicting'.
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Doctor Shemp
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Re: Superb Demo Sisters Enters Beta

Post by Doctor Shemp »

Another video.

4-1 (Doctor Shemp)
I can't test this fairly.
4-2 (Compound Fraxure) (note that this is the old version of the level. I recorded this before the update)
Don't put the player in immediate danger.
Why are there slopes?
The land you jump to from the paragoopa can't be seen until you land on the paragoopa, making it semi-blind.
4-3 (Axon)
4-4 (Weston Smith)
If you do include a maze path you'll need to drop the difficulty quite a bit. Even without the maze paths it's a bit of a difficulty spike compared to the rest of World 4. This could be fixed by making the one powerup at the start easier to get.
5-1 (Weston Smith)
Either have a second powerup or don't make the only one hard to get.
The jumps at the end are too hard due to the ice physics and the need to stall your momentum to deal with the paragoopa.
5-2 (aterraformer)
I still think it's very odd that banansnakes don't seriously show up until this level on rather than from 3-1 on. This level may be too hard for its placement too or it may just be my hatred of ice physics.
5-3 (Diggertron)
This level was meant to introduce bullet bills that aren't shot out of a launcher. It doesn't.
5-4 (Mabel)
What's up with "saem" in the bonus area?
6-1 (MonkeyShrapnel)
Might be a bit too easy for its placement but it works as a breather level.
6-2 (KingTwelveSixteen)
KingTwelveSixteen is misspelled as "Seventeen" in the intro to the level.
The artwork just before the one that has the sign on it has a three-tile continuous slope that makes a control issue.
The sign needs to be removed.
6-3 (Pholtos)
Isn't this level meant to be a night level?
The starting castle looks odd on a mushroom top.
6-4 (swirlybomb)
This was a great castle! A tough but nice challenge though which you can tell by my reaction when I finally beat it.
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