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A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby WasabiJellyfish » 2 years ago

SAJewers wrote:Can we not multiple acts pertaining to one episode? I'd rather have each episode be one flowing plot. Make Episode 1 = Act 1, Ep2 = Act 2, etc.
What Rocky said^ It's a very integral part of keeping viewers engaged in your story. What you're saying with not splitting it into too many parts is an important thing and I feel it's kind of something that went a bit awry in episode 1. All the planets felt just kind of disjointed and rushed up until Colonial Seattle and I think that was to do with basing the plot around the levels.

It just ends up rather a mess like all the Sheath interludes were randomly sparsed with no real intention apart from them being "Castle Levels" It'd be fine if every single end to a planet was a throwback to an old retro game because those End of World things showing up in those levels were pretty funny. However it did lead to a lot of the planets just being sort of anticlimactic? Cause you'd go through all these levels and then another castle level that felt no different to the previous ones (Colonial Seattle notwithstanding) and suddenly oh that was the end of that world then.

I guess it's kind of part of the charm of the talkhaus though the fact that the whole game feels like "Non-Sequitur The Game". However I think a bit more world building and slightly more heavy plot focus would not go amiss in Episode 2.

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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Imaynotbehere4long » 2 years ago

Imaynotbehere4long wrote:I'm thinking it would be better to have the first level pick up where episode 1 left off and have the player play as Sheath going through the post-production void (it could be a puzzle level where the player has to reassemble the reality stabilizer or something).
Is it okay if I go ahead and make ^this level? I ask because I've had a few ideas pop into my head recently regarding it, but I don't know if it would be accepted as it would effectively change the current planned timeline for the episodes.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby SAJewers » 2 years ago

So, what's going on with the story/plot for Ep2? I think we should start talking about the plot now, since we have quite a few levels in the submissions list. I realize not everything in the submissions list will get approved (seriously guys, could use some help here), but I think there's enough there for us to go on.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Imaynotbehere4long » 2 years ago

SAJewers wrote:So, what's going on with the story/plot for Ep2?
If The Post Production Void gets accepted, we could make jokes about how the alternate reality has more advanced technology as a reference to the fact that Episode 1 didn't use LunaLua. Aside from that, my level shouldn't have too much bearing on the plot other than where the episode takes place (an alternate reality) and which characters can be used (as Science and most of the other siblings (as well as the entire Analog Funk reality) cease to exist).

Of course, if my level gets accepted, but you still really want to use the other siblings at some point, you could say that they also managed to escape the collapsing reality by other means.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby docopoper » 2 years ago

We need to work Mike in as a cameo somehow and have him do something really annoyingly foolhardy. I'm not really privy to the actual plot of this episode though.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby SAJewers » 2 years ago

Imaynotbehere4long wrote:
SAJewers wrote:So, what's going on with the story/plot for Ep2?
If The Post Production Void gets accepted, we could make jokes about how the alternate reality has more advanced technology as a reference to the fact that Episode 1 didn't use LunaLua. Aside from that, my level shouldn't have too much bearing on the plot other than where the episode takes place (an alternate reality) and which characters can be used (as Science and most of the other siblings (as well as the entire Analog Funk reality) cease to exist).

Of course, if my level gets accepted, but you still really want to use the other siblings at some point, you could say that they also managed to escape the collapsing reality by other means.
Just note that may not work, as I have been planning on backporting most EP2 LUA features to EP1 (infact The latest update to EP1 uses Lua to fix a bug in a level, and if I get around to it, I might add lua to Town4 for a furba count).
docopoper wrote:We need to work Mike in as a cameo somehow and have him do something really annoyingly foolhardy. I'm not really privy to the actual plot of this episode though.
Not sure how we'd do it, but I'd be for that.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Imaynotbehere4long » 2 years ago

SAJewers wrote:I have been planning on backporting most EP2 LUA features to EP1
I know; that's why I said "a reference to the fact that Episode 1 didn't use LunaLua." Either way, it's not a big deal if it doesn't happen.

Actually, that gives me an idea: one of the towns could be on the moon and be populated by self-proclaimed "lunatics," and it would be portrayed as an extremely technically advanced society and heavily feature stuff that requires LunaLua to implement.

By the way, I don't know if it's a good idea to be discussing the plot before submissions are closed. There's always the chance that we come up with a really good idea, then someone submits a good level that somehow can't fit into said idea, forcing it to be reworked. If we wait until submissions are over, we know all the levels we have to work with as well as their difficulty/general order of appearance in the episode.

If you're just talking about general things, I thought we had that figured out already.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Rockythechao » 2 years ago

Imaynotbehere4long wrote:Actually, that gives me an idea: one of the towns could be on the moon and be populated by self-proclaimed "lunatics," and it would be portrayed as an extremely technically advanced society and heavily feature stuff that requires LunaLua to implement.
I've seen some talk of tech demo-style towns before, though this one sounds particularly nifty. Why not post that idea in the town thread?
(If such a town does make it into the game, I wanna be the wacky mad scientist character living on the outskirts of the town/city who constantly has his inventions exploding in his face)
By the way, I don't know if it's a good idea to be discussing the plot before submissions are closed. There's always the chance that we come up with a really good idea, then someone submits a good level that somehow can't fit into said idea, forcing it to be reworked. If we wait until submissions are over, we know all the levels we have to work with as well as their difficulty/general order of appearance in the episode.
If a level doesn't end up fitting neatly into any of the worlds once they've been established, it could be saved for Ep. 3. We could also make the level unlockable content or part of the post-game bonus world.

I don't see the harm in brainstorming as long as we don't go too in-depth and get attached to any given idea. In fact, it might be best to start compiling a list of the story ideas that have been proposed earlier in this thread.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby SAJewers » 2 years ago

Just a note that towns will belike in EP1 where they're thematically based on the theme of the world that they're in.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby docopoper » 2 years ago

It's also not that big of a deal if some levels don't contribute to the plot. Though it would be nice to make all the worlds more like world 4 was in episode 1 (but not to the point where we're getting at all serious about the plot).
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Imaynotbehere4long » 2 years ago

Imaynotbehere4long wrote:Of course, if my level gets accepted, but you still really want to use the other siblings at some point, you could say that they also managed to escape the collapsing reality by other means.
On second thought, scratch this idea. If you want to have the siblings appear at some point, just say that they're their alternate-reality counterparts, not the ones from Analog Funk (with the exception of Pandamona and coin-Calleoca). In fact, I was thinking that we could have a cut-scene somewhere in the episode where Analog Funk Pandamona meets Episode 2 Pandamona, and they get into an argument and destroy each other (or join forces. Or both).

Another idea I had is to have everyone from Analog Funk speak with normal text boxes, but everyone from Episode 2 speak with CinematX. That would be an easy, obvious way to differentiate characters from each reality.
Rockythechao wrote:If a level doesn't end up fitting neatly into any of the worlds once they've been established, it could be saved for Ep. 3. We could also make the level unlockable content or part of the post-game bonus world.
Post-game slots should be reserved for the hardest levels, not levels that couldn't fit anywhere else; that was one of my problems with Analog Funk. Similarly, unlockable levels should also have something special about their gameplay that makes them worth unlocking rather than just being leftover levels. Saving them for Episode 3 is what I would prefer, though there is at least one level (mine) that can only work as an Episode 2 level.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby SAJewers » 2 years ago

If a level is submitted and approved for EP2, It'll be used in Ep2. Only exceptions will be if the level creator opts to remove it from Ep2 and use the level in Ep3 instead (like with Totally Trollied in Ep1/Ep2).

Should also be noted that I've seen at least 1 level with a sibling, and that there were plans for having Garish, Pily, and Mishi be unlockable character swaps via the raocoin system.
Imaynotbehere4long wrote: Post-game slots should be reserved for the hardest levels, not levels that couldn't fit anywhere else
That's the way it was in Ep1, and it'll be that way in Ep2.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Imaynotbehere4long » 2 years ago

SAJewers wrote:Should also be noted that I've seen at least 1 level with a sibling, and that there were plans for having Garish, Pily, and Mishi be unlockable character swaps via the raocoin system.
I had the feeling something like that would happen; that's why I changed my suggestion to them being alternate reality counterparts. After all, Analog Funk Garish flat-out died anyway, and Analog Funk Mishi erased herself from existence before the collapse of reality could do that instead.

The easiest explanation for having them reappear (and maybe even act a bit differently) would be to have them be alternate reality counterparts.
SAJewers wrote:
Imaynotbehere4long wrote: Post-game slots should be reserved for the hardest levels, not levels that couldn't fit anywhere else
That's the way it was in Ep1
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby SAJewers » 2 years ago

Those first two were considered way too hard, and I believe we had to get those levels nerfed. IIRC They almost got rejected for being impossible. Johnson McCain wasn't considered hard at all, just maybe a tad too hard for World 4.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby romajiQuadhash » 2 years ago

Imaynotbehere4long wrote:
SAJewers wrote:I have been planning on backporting most EP2 LUA features to EP1
I know; that's why I said "a reference to the fact that Episode 1 didn't use LunaLua." Either way, it's not a big deal if it doesn't happen.

Actually, that gives me an idea: one of the towns could be on the moon and be populated by self-proclaimed "lunatics," and it would be portrayed as an extremely technically advanced society and heavily feature stuff that requires LunaLua to implement.

By the way, I don't know if it's a good idea to be discussing the plot before submissions are closed. There's always the chance that we come up with a really good idea, then someone submits a good level that somehow can't fit into said idea, forcing it to be reworked. If we wait until submissions are over, we know all the levels we have to work with as well as their difficulty/general order of appearance in the episode.

If you're just talking about general things, I thought we had that figured out already.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby romajiQuadhash » 2 years ago

Rockythechao wrote:
Imaynotbehere4long wrote:Actually, that gives me an idea: one of the towns could be on the moon and be populated by self-proclaimed "lunatics," and it would be portrayed as an extremely technically advanced society and heavily feature stuff that requires LunaLua to implement.
I've seen some talk of tech demo-style towns before, though this one sounds particularly nifty. Why not post that idea in the town thread?
(If such a town does make it into the game, I wanna be the wacky mad scientist character living on the outskirts of the town/city who constantly has his inventions exploding in his face)
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby SAJewers » 2 years ago

http://asmbxt.wikia.com/wiki/ASMT_Series_Story#Timeline
After seeing this get posted on the wiki (thanks), I had a bit of thought on the timeline, and came up with a revised timeline:

ASMT and AZCT happen at roughly the same time. The ASMT Plot Stands as it is (with the ending being. I haven't kept up with AZCT, so where that places can be debated, and can be made to with that project).

After the events of ASMT, Demo teams up with Iris to figure out what happened, and it leads them to the Castle of no Significance. Sheath and Kood are also lead to the Castle., and ASMBXT Happens where they defeat the Key Boss. How raocow fits in is I guess debateable.

Then, a separate ship comes along and kickstarts A2XT Ep1 with the Siblings. The world ends and whatnot. Meanwhile, in an alternate reality, Demo and crew go through Zebraspace and get a 9th Super Leek.

Then Ep2 happens right after the Ep1 World 8 cutscene. After collecting the Super Leeks, Demo and crew are taken to the alternate reality that had the 9th super leek. Somehow write out the other demo crew. Maybe use Deus Ex Machina and bring the ring from Ep1's World 1 end cutscene to fix everything. Demo and crew go after Pandamona (who somehow has the 9th leek). Defeating Pandamona introduces the 5 Uncles. Before the world ends again, they escape through another Zebraspace to another Alternate Reality.

Ep3 happens with the Elders as the antagonists. This stuff TBD.

Ep4 happens with the Artist. Involves a lot of raocow retrospectives, and celebrates 10 years of raocow.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Imaynotbehere4long » 2 years ago

SAJewers wrote:The world ends and whatnot. Meanwhile, in an alternate reality, Demo and crew go through Zebraspace and get a 9th Super Leek.
Actually, I just got another idea regarding Zebraspace: instead of it being an alternate reality/noncanon/whatever, it exists solely in the Castle of No Significance (at least, it does in Analog Funk's reality; maybe it could have a pocket entrance in all realities), but those who venture into it get their mind warped and occasionally gain memories of things that didn't happen. In other words, Demo and crew will think that they went through Zebraspace to get a 9th super leek, but that was just the after-effect of going through Zebraspace from ASMBXT. It could be explained in Ep2's intro kinda like this:

Sheath: "...and so I went all throughout A Final Thing (Name Pending) to get the eight super leeks that we got on our journey to fix--"
Demo: "Eight? I thought we went through Zebraspace and got a ninth one."
Kood: "Tell me, did you go through a castle to get to Zebraspace, or did it just kinda happen?"
Iris: "Well, we went through a castle the first time, but it just kinda happened when we went to get the 9th super leek."
Kood: "Ah, it appears your mind went under the effects of Zebraspace. All those who enter fall under a spell where they will randomly gain false memories of returning there."
Demo: "But I could have sworn it was real!"
Kood: "That's how powerful Zebraspace's spell is; it will seem real, but if you think about it logically, you will realize that it is impossible for those memories to be true. After all, your reality collapsed right after you got the 8th super leek, so there's no way that you could have returned to the U.S.S. HUB to get a ninth one."
raocow: "Wow, now that you mention it, you're right."

Plus, it will give us an excuse to have a pseudo-noncanon postgame for each episode without having to explain it each time: just make it Zebraspace.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby SAJewers » 2 years ago

Except the postgame of ASMT was entirely cannon.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Pyro » 2 years ago

I'm not entirely sure if reality should blow up again at the end of Ep2. IMO I found the ending to Ep1 way too quickly paced, overly silly, and kinda insulting. I don't specifically have any other ideas for the Ep2 story, but it was just a thing that was bothering me.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Imaynotbehere4long » 2 years ago

SAJewers wrote:Except the postgame of ASMT was entirely cannon.
I admit that I haven't played much of ASMT (the chocolate rain boss broke on me, so I gave up for the time being), but I meant that the pseudo-noncanon post-games would begin post-ASMBXT with the impression that ASMBXT takes place after ASMT. If ASMT's postgame takes place in Zebraspace, we could say the effects begin there (and maybe even that Zebraspace exists in its own reality) and that the Zebraspace sections in ASMBXT are also noncanon.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby WestonSmith » 2 years ago

As a relative outsider to the ASMT and A2XT stories, as well as having no real idea of what's been discussed for Episode 2's plot, I'll still toss in my two cents on Zebra Space: Having it be a literal land of discontinuity outside of reality makes it both easy to handwave issues it causes with the story and a really handy plot device. After all, my general understanding of A2XT was that reality itself was destroyed, but if Zebra Space is outside of reality, then it could be the ultimate Chekhov's Gun.

I won't get into details on how I think Episode 2's plot should flow, but having Zebra Space's non-cannon status being a major part of the plot is the kind of fourth wall destroying story element that fits right in with a game that will theoretically open with a trip through the end of reality by a character who's entire existence is summed up as "she was there too." It also offers a method of moving the story into the next game without repeating the same time-warp plot device that connects Episode 1 and 2.

Take that as you will.

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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby WasabiJellyfish » 2 years ago

Pyro wrote:I'm not entirely sure if reality should blow up again at the end of Ep2. IMO I found the ending to Ep1 way too quickly paced, overly silly, and kinda insulting. I don't specifically have any other ideas for the Ep2 story, but it was just a thing that was bothering me.
I really agree with Pyro here. We need to make sure the story is actually good as a story and not just a bunch of threads and dumb jokes linking stuff together.
Which then also means it should be good as it's own thing not as part of a set of 3. You know when raocow said during Episode 1 "It really doesn't feel like the game is ending"? That's because the pacing was so weird that there was no stakes or build up, stuff just kinda happened.

I feel like we're stuck with the whole time travel multiverse schtick at the moment but I think we should work on making the story feel impactful and good before we worry about in jokes.

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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby docopoper » 2 years ago

There is nothing wrong with having piles of nonsense unrelated story threads. The last thing we want for this game is for it to take itself seriously. Having a weak story also helped levels have creative freedom in Episode 1.
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Re: A2MBXT Cutscenes and Story SPOILERS (no raocows allowed)

Postby Hoeloe » 2 years ago

docopoper wrote:There is nothing wrong with having piles of nonsense unrelated story threads. The last thing we want for this game is for it to take itself seriously. Having a weak story also helped levels have creative freedom in Episode 1.
There's a difference between a joke story and a badly crafted one. Just throwing in plot wherever won't make for a good story, silly or otherwise. Spending some time working out how to fit the silliness together in a way that works will produce a better experience.

Remember everyone, story does not have to be serious.
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