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AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

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KingTwelveSixteen
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by KingTwelveSixteen »

jayScribble wrote:
I then realized that you need to be in the whirlwind to get to the other side.
I did so and got through, but with one heart left, I was dead in the 6 blue leevers room.
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SO OBVIOUS NOW :?
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Nimono
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Nimono »

jayScribble wrote:Well, I tried the latest .qst: what a long level you made.

WHAT

It feels too short to me! D: Then again, I kinda skip every enemy unless I need to beat it to get through...


I was really stuck on the mirror puzzle:
at first, I though that you had to use the wizzrobe attacks to activate the blue star thingy and I was about to report that the puzzle was not working.
I then realize the wording "whirlwind" was related to the whistle, so at first I used the whirlwind to hit the blue star: no dice.
I then tried to hit the mirror directly with the whirlwind: for some reason it passed through it. I then tried it again, only this time I was positioned 1/3 tile down: it hit the mirror and I saw it reflecting among the other mirrors and hit the the blue star: still nothing happened.
I then realized that you need to be in the whirlwind to get to the other side.
I did so and got through, but with one heart left, I was dead in the 6 blue leevers room.
A smart puzzle, but this is something that people will get stuck on for a while.

Riolu180 response:
Hmm... Maybe I should add some more text to the guy room that mentions that the star-like object stops the whirlwind, although I don't want to say "HEY THIS DELETES THE WHIRLWIND AND DEPOSITS LINK WHERE IT WAS"; that's giving it away! lol
Without further ado, a bug report:
zelda005.png
For some reason, going up the ladder here is a problem: I need to be exactly in the middle to get up there. (I know that you can do the jump with the roc's feather, but someone less patient would find this annoying to do.
zelda006.png
In loving memory...
After beating the dungeon, I was warped to this room: there was no music and the "walking in the black" glitch happened. I then went back here doing the walking in black thing and going back to where I came from and this is where I end up:
zelda007.png
I know this is after the dungeon so nothing too major.
1: Weird. I'll try to get Moosh's attention; I think this is a bug with his script, blocking you when there's blank tiles to your sides making it tough for you to be in the exact center.
2: I'm not going to do like raekuul and make a temporary overworld because I wouldn't want people to build around it just because I put the entrance where I did, thus making me decide the course of the overworld with no one else's input. :(


That boss is hard to catch: good thing I packed my boomerang to stop it.

IT IS A PLACEHOLDER. :D
You know the drill. ;P
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jayScribble
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by jayScribble »

I was thinking more of this as a hint:
In the room of reflection, let the wind carry you to the star(s).
After reading you previous posts, I did realize that the nerfed Black Leever was a placeholder boss, but the enemy in general is really a demon to handle.

Are you gonna give us a surprise with the custom boss you're gonna make in this dungeon?
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Nimono
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Nimono »

jayScribble wrote:I was thinking more of this as a hint:
In the room of reflection, let the wind carry you to the star(s).
That sounds good, although...
That doesn't really tell people that the whirlwinds can be reflected by mirrors. Oh, and I forgot to mention last time: I don't know how to make the whirlwinds always reflect on the mirrors. If you're half a block away, it won't reflect. And it's annoying. Also that puzzle's mostly there to set it up for other people to use it in their dungeons. XP
jayScribble wrote:After reading you previous posts, I did realize that the nerfed Black Leever was a placeholder boss, but the enemy in general is really a demon to handle.
I put it there specifically because it's a demon. Basically, since there's no boss, I wanted to frustrate everyone. X3
jayScribble wrote:Are you gonna give us a surprise with the custom boss you're gonna make in this dungeon?
Maybe! By "surprise", do you mean "keep what it is hidden until we find out ourselves", or do you mean "are you gonna give us tiny bits of information"? Former, yes, latter, nope.avi. :3

...OH GOSH I CHANGED HOW I RESPONDED TO QUOTES! IT'S A MIRACLE!
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Neobullseye
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Neobullseye »

Testing done, no bugs to report :D. At least, none that haven't been reported yet.

Also, I really like the inclusion of those Flute Shortcuts. It makes the dungeon feel a lot more fluid, or so to speak.
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Doctor Shemp »

jayScribble wrote:I was thinking more of this as a hint:
In the room of reflection, let the wind carry you to the star(s).
After reading you previous posts, I did realize that the nerfed Black Leever was a placeholder boss, but the enemy in general is really a demon to handle.

Are you gonna give us a surprise with the custom boss you're gonna make in this dungeon?
Needs more bad-translation induced crypticness.
WIND LIFTS TO STARS WHEN YOU SEE YOURSELF
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jayScribble
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by jayScribble »

Riolu180 wrote:
That doesn't really tell people that the whirlwinds can be reflected by mirrors. Oh, and I forgot to mention last time: I don't know how to make the whirlwinds always reflect on the mirrors. If you're half a block away, it won't reflect. And it's annoying. Also that puzzle's mostly there to set it up for other people to use it in their dungeons. XP
I think the mirror tile being shaped like a diagonal rather than a whole square is the problem.

However I've broken the puzzle:
If you're on the top tiles and you use the whistle, you can still can get to the blue star without using the mirrors.
That's all I got, and the hint is slightly more easier to understand if you do the above.
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Nimono »

jayScribble wrote:I think the mirror tile being shaped like a diagonal rather than a whole square is the problem.

However I've broken the puzzle:
If you're on the top tiles and you use the whistle, you can still can get to the blue star without using the mirrors.
That's all I got, and the hint is slightly more easier to understand if you do the above.
The shape doesn't affect the hitbox of them, though. :/
Oh, really? Hahaha. I'll leave it like that because people could use it to speedrun if they know about it.
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by KingTwelveSixteen »

Riolu180 wrote: And no, I don't think there's a rule to be able to use the whistle more than once.
BAM!
http://zcguides.celestialrealm.net/_med ... histle.png
See that button in the picture? Press that then save it!

Gotta remember to put that into the final thing as well...
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Nimono
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Nimono »

KingTwelveSixteen wrote: BAM!
http://zcguides.celestialrealm.net/_med ... histle.png
See that button in the picture? Press that then save it!

Gotta remember to put that into the final thing as well...
Oh! Thanks, thanks! :D
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by CodeGorilla »

So I played through the version of the dungeon currently in the first post (as of 1:56 PM EST). For the most part, the dungeon is pretty good. Individual comments:

Some of the Wizzrobes might be a bit much, especially when you consider that they take something like four hearts on a successful hit. I'm not saying avoid them altogether, but you might put one or two in each of the rooms that currently have four.

I have the same comment about the mirrors as everyone else - I only got it to work when you're halfway down the tile.

Glad to know that the black leever is just a placeholder, because even though it's a pain in the neck to kill, it lacks the splash factor of an actual boss, plus it's pretty easily dealt with by the boomerang.
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Nimono »

CodeGorilla wrote:Some of the Wizzrobes might be a bit much, especially when you consider that they take something like four hearts on a successful hit. I'm not saying avoid them altogether, but you might put one or two in each of the rooms that currently have four.
What. ;_; I forgot they had seperate damage for their Magic. Umm..........should I make copies of them that do less damage...? D:
I have the same comment about the mirrors as everyone else - I only got it to work when you're halfway down the tile.
It's impossible to fix, unfortunately. It's a quirk with the engine itself. Perhaps I should just rework that room, removing the need to use the mirrors?
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by CodeGorilla »

Riolu180 wrote: What. ;_; I forgot they had seperate damage for their Magic. Umm..........should I make copies of them that do less damage...? D:
Possibly. If the magic did less damage, it would be more reasonable. The thing is, they're pretty easy to avoid, but tedious to kill. In the room with the mirrors in particular, since the mirror is picky about your location, you kind of need to kill off the Wizzrobes before messing with the puzzle. Less damage would mean you don't need to mind as much about the damage.
It's impossible to fix, unfortunately. It's a quirk with the engine itself. Perhaps I should just rework that room, removing the need to use the mirrors?
I hope it doesn't come to this, because I really like the mirror puzzle. Maybe (since this is the first instance of this kind of puzzle) you have some kind of marking on the ground to show the precise spot at which Link/whoever must stand? i.e. something like:

Code: Select all

         /
        / 
-----  /  
| | | /   
-----/    
-----     
| | |      
-----     
          
          
That way there's a visual cue to follow. Just a thought.
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by raekuul »

I would also recommend the visual cue, since other people in later dungeons may decide to use mirror puzzles and having one this early with start point instructions would be a major boon.

*insert visual pun here*
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Neobullseye »

raekuul wrote:I would also recommend the visual cue, since other people in later dungeons may decide to use mirror puzzles and having one this early with start point instructions would be a major boon.

*insert visual pun here*
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by jayScribble »

Neobullseye wrote:
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It had to be done.
That had me laughing for a good while.

On a more serious note, a visual hint in the hint room would have worked out for figuring out the misalignment of the mirror, sort of like what CodeGorrila got.
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Nimono »

Okay, so since you guys want a visual cue...either suggest me something specific to place as a hint, or someone please make me a graphic for it, 'cause I have no idea what to use. :(
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by CodeGorilla »

Riolu180 wrote:Okay, so since you guys want a visual cue...either suggest me something specific to place as a hint, or someone please make me a graphic for it, 'cause I have no idea what to use. :(
Taking an example from Level 0: Wizzrobe's House:
Image
Here you can see a subtle visual cue that indicates which of the blocks should be pushed to open the door onward. Perhaps something like the following would be sufficient:
Image
If (depending on platform limitations) you had the tiles to spare, you could even use the same note-block tile you use elsewhere in the dungeon, but shifted halfway. It would eat two more tiles, though I have no idea if that would actually be an issue or not.
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by Nimono »

CodeGorilla wrote: Here you can see a subtle visual cue that indicates which of the blocks should be pushed to open the door onward. Perhaps something like the following would be sufficient:
Image
If (depending on platform limitations) you had the tiles to spare, you could even use the same note-block tile you use elsewhere in the dungeon, but shifted halfway. It would eat two more tiles, though I have no idea if that would actually be an issue or not.
Ummmmm... Why would you stand THERE of all places? D: From my experience, it doesn't reflect unless you're just about exactly on its level. So you'd need one tile, not two. (It'd be so much easier if we didn't have diagonal movement on...)
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Re: AZCT - LEVEL 3 (Whistle) Thread

Post by CodeGorilla »

Riolu180 wrote:
CodeGorilla wrote: Here you can see a subtle visual cue that indicates which of the blocks should be pushed to open the door onward. Perhaps something like the following would be sufficient:
Image
If (depending on platform limitations) you had the tiles to spare, you could even use the same note-block tile you use elsewhere in the dungeon, but shifted halfway. It would eat two more tiles, though I have no idea if that would actually be an issue or not.
Ummmmm... Why would you stand THERE of all places? D: From my experience, it doesn't reflect unless you're just about exactly on its level. So you'd need one tile, not two. (It'd be so much easier if we didn't have diagonal movement on...)
From my experience, that's where you need to stand in order for it to actually work. If I line up perfectly with the mirror, I just phase through it and end up back at the dungeon entrance.

EDIT: Okay, I tried it again just to double check my placement, and it seemed to work alright when I was actually lined up with the mirror this time. I'm not sure what the problem I was having originally was.
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