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Donkey Kong Country 3 - Unbelievable type of a situation

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Donkey Kong Country 3 - Unbelievable type of a situation

Postby Leet » 1 month ago

Donkey Kong Country 3 is the third and final in Rare's trilogy of DKC games, which I'm sure doesn't need stating.
DKC3 heavily followed the lead of DKC2, with the main addition being a (relatively) in-depth world map to explore.

1 - grizzly windmill (Bounty Beach, Lakeside Limbo, Doorstop Dash)
2 - big bear belly flop (Smuggler's Cove, Tidal Trouble, Skidda's Row)
3 - quick upper rush (Murky Mill, Belcha's Barn, Barrel Shield Bust-Up)
4 - hammer rush (Riverside Race, Squeals on Wheels)
5 - stone head (Springin' Spiders, Bobbing Barrel Brawl, Arich's Hoard, Arich's Ambush)
6 - salmon hunter (Kong Cave, Bazza's Blockade, Rocket Barrel Ride)
7 - hunting claw (Kreeping Klasps, Tracker Barrel Trek, Fish Food Frenzy)
8 - bear rush (Squirt's Showdown, Bounty Bay, Fire-Ball Frenzy, Demolition Drain-Pipe)
9 - bear heaven cannon (Ripsaw Rage, Blazing Bazukas, Low-G Labyrinth, Kaos Karnage)
10 - circus roll (Undercover Cove, Krevice Kreepers, Tearaway Toboggan)
11 - hunting bear stance (Barrel Drop Bounce, Krack-Shot Kroc, Lemguin Lunge)
12 - grizzly fling (Bleak's House, Sky-High Secret, Buzzer Barrage)
13 - sit down (Kong-Fused Cliffs, Clifftop Cache, Floodlit Fish, Pot Hole Panic)
14 - bear swing (Ropey Rumpus, Barbos's Barrier, Glacial Grotto)
15 - bear upper rush (Stampede Sprint, Criss Kross Cliffs)
16 - rag doll (Tyrant Twin Tussle, Swoopy Salvo)
17 - demon bear (Konveyor Rope Klash, Creepy Caverns, Sewer Stockpile)
18 - turn around dance (Lightning Look-Out, Koindozer Klamber, Poisonous Pipeline)
19 - windmill backhand (Kastle Kaos)
FINAL - 20 - fatal wind (Rocket Rush!, Knautilus, Belcha's Burrow, Hill-Top Hoard, K's Kache)

When I grew up and found out that DKC3 wasn't considered as much of a classic as DKC2, I was shocked, because it was the one I played the most as a child and never seemed that different to me from 2. And the reasons I was seeing at the time ("they changed the design of some enemies!") did little to convince me. But to be fair, when you're a child you also have little concept of things like "level design". Either way, I'm excited to watch this.
Last edited by Leet on 12 Oct 2019, 21:04, edited 15 times in total.
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Grounder » 1 month ago

so chunky and kiddy are totally bros, right? :catplanet:
Why don't you eat me?

I am perfectly tasty...

AND I'LL STEAL YOUR SOUL! :twisted:

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Xenesis » 1 month ago

To be honest, I would have thought raocow would be a bigger fan of "Donkey Kong Country: Canada"

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby raocow » 1 month ago

child me couldn't get over the whole 'why aren't they pirates anymore'
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby BurntTenda » 1 month ago

I've actually never seen footage or even any screen of this game.
It does kinda feel like it's lacking something, but I'm not sure what.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Alice » 1 month ago

raocow wrote: child me couldn't get over the whole 'why aren't they pirates anymore'
They weren't pirates in the first one so I honestly don't know why you would expect they'd still be pirates in DKC3. Though I also don't know why you seem to have made some sort of mental connection between pirates and a game being charming anyways.

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Voltgloss » 1 month ago

Alice wrote:
raocow wrote: child me couldn't get over the whole 'why aren't they pirates anymore'
They weren't pirates in the first one so I honestly don't know why you would expect they'd still be pirates in DKC3. Though I also don't know why you seem to have made some sort of mental connection between pirates and a game being charming anyways.
I suspect raocow's reaction may be less about pirates specifically, and more about "they went heavy on a cohesive theme in the second game, which now they've removed and replaced with ... no theme?"

Unless a replacement theme is going to show up as the game continues. I've never played this so I've no idea if that's the case.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Cyril » 1 month ago

Dixie Kong and The Other One
i've honestly never played a video game in my life

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Bean » 1 month ago

This one's also my favorite. Wasn't a huge fan of the broody atmosphere of the second game, so the return to a more vibrant, colorful adventure was much appreciated. Plus I like the gameplay decisions here since it changes a lot of things up. Whether it's for better or worse overall is what makes or breaks the game to a lot of people. Put me in the "make" crowd.

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby MonkeyShrapnel » 1 month ago

Voltgloss wrote: I suspect raocow's reaction may be less about pirates specifically, and more about "they went heavy on a cohesive theme in the second game, which now they've removed and replaced with ... no theme?"

Unless a replacement theme is going to show up as the game continues. I've never played this so I've no idea if that's the case.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Mandew » 1 month ago

MonkeyShrapnel wrote:
Voltgloss wrote: I suspect raocow's reaction may be less about pirates specifically, and more about "they went heavy on a cohesive theme in the second game, which now they've removed and replaced with ... no theme?"

Unless a replacement theme is going to show up as the game continues. I've never played this so I've no idea if that's the case.
video
even if this video's main point did align with the true intents of the game's writers, I heavily disagree about the cohesion being there, and I would argue against it being well-executed in any capacity. In fact, if it were true, that would make my perception of the game's works even worse off than before.

Let's suppose there is, in fact, an intended "dark theme" to this game. There are far too many elements that go in conflict to such a vibe. For one, the enemies look more cartoonish than ever before -- and behave in even more cartoonish ways. While the game does present many aspects of "horrifying if you think about them", it's pretty much par for the course with basically any platformer of the time. It just doesn't do enough to offset that conflict and really glue everything together. I just think the proposed "vibe" doesn't sell well in the slightest. If the "vibe" is what was intended, it would definitely be a huge failure on the part of the developers.

So the result of this video's argument is the possibility that the devs did go for a theme and executed it extremely poorly, which is a step down from my previous thinking that the devs weren't really going for that at all.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Leet » 1 month ago

I feel like you may have missed the key passage of the video
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Mandew » 1 month ago

Leet wrote: I feel like you may have missed the key passage of the video
No, not in the slightest. I'm aware the video explains a point of view that says "there was cohesion after all". My argument is that even if there were, it's so poorly done that it might as well not have been there in the first place. If I were to consider the video's point as true, it makes the developers behind this game seem even less competent to me than I thought before watching it.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Leet » 1 month ago

Then why didn't you mention anything about the theme in your post?

Sorry if that sounds flippant but I'm not sure what else to say because there's a big gap in understanding here. Are we in different universes?
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Mandew » 1 month ago

Leet wrote: Then why didn't you mention anything about the theme in your post?
if you're talking about the "industrial revolution" theme, it
1. brings nothing beyond explaining the places you're visiting
2. it was meant to be "subtle", yet finding out about it does not change the meaning of even any single pixel of this game

it's so hollow and void that it's basically irrelevant.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Leet » 1 month ago

I don't know why so vitriolic but yes this was my point of confusion - it seemed obvious to me that that was the relevant passage of the video, and that the point of cohesion being proposed was not at all some vague "dark vibe". (That was just the overarching theme of the video, bigger than + irrelevant to this discussion.) So I didn't know why your post thought that was the point of cohesion being proposed.

Like you can say "well that's stupid too" and ok fair enough but it hardly seems like an afterthought, I was very confused

I'm also not sure what non-hollow meaning "pirates!!!" brings to dkc2, it's all pretty arbitrary and it deviates from that constantly, but that's not bad to me either
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Mandew » 1 month ago

Leet wrote: I don't know why so vitriolic but yes this was my point of confusion - it seemed obvious to me that that was the relevant passage of the video, and that the point of cohesion being proposed was not at all some vague "dark vibe". (That was just the overarching theme of the video, bigger than + irrelevant to this discussion.) So I didn't know why your post thought that was the point of cohesion being proposed.

Like you can say "well that's stupid too" and ok fair enough but it hardly seems like an afterthought, I was very confused

I'm also not sure what non-hollow meaning "pirates!!!" brings to dkc2, it's all pretty arbitrary and it deviates from that constantly, but that's not bad to me either
I apologize for my explanations being clumsy, and I thank you for inviting me to clarify.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Piesonscreations » 1 month ago

I don't know about the game being ugly for now. Like, these first three levels have had a better color pallette than DKC1's poopy brown everything on those first few stages, in my opinion.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Mandew » 1 month ago

Piesonscreations wrote: I don't know about the game being ugly for now. Like, these first three levels have had a better color pallette than DKC1's poopy brown everything on those first few stages, in my opinion.
when this game does its aesthetic right, it knocks it out of the park. The overworld maps and first few levels have an amazing palette of delightful, vibrant colors, and level of detail, for example in how the water's surface and depths are handled, are honestly incredible.

I can't say the same for some of the baddies, though. There was a focus on bringing a higher fidelity with the enemy's sprite graphics. As a result, each tone occupy a larger part of the palette, leaving less room for colorful additions or other type of decoration. The devs went with a decision that hard-limited them on that front; the first of many things I would call "clumsy" about this game's ideas and executions.
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Leet » 1 month ago

random thought but i never realized in my life that the bee was supposed to be mechanical
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Kilgamayan » 1 month ago

This was/is my favorite DKC game by a country mile don't @ me

Also I thoroughly enjoy watching raoguy play games where the commonly-collectible currency is actually required to advance the plot, so this will have that extra level of fun 8)
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby Crunchy » 1 month ago

heck yeah dkc3

i am totally on board with Northern Kremisphere = canada being canon

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby WestonSmith » 1 month ago

DKC3 is my long time favourite of the series. I love the music, the cartoonish graphics, the level gimmicks, the bosses, and the fantastic world map. Like, this might be the best map in any game ever.

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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - The Kongtroversial Kongklusion

Postby J. J. W. Mezun » 1 month ago

I think we should've saved “Kongtroversial Kongklusion” for DK64, since that’s arguably the true conclusion to the Rare series.

I’m disappointed that raocow isn’t playing with the “MERRY” cheat on & that nobody else has castigated him for it yet.

I think this game is underrated, but I would agree it’s not as good as DKC2. In its defense, though — ¿what is? While DKC2 is mo’ consistent in terms o’ level design, DKC3 can oft be mo’ creative, which is impressive for a 3rd game. DKC3 has some very out-there gimmicks — & e’en if they’re sometimes frustrating & sometimes don’t work, I can always forgive DKC3 for it mo’ than other games ’cause it’s a’least memorable when it’s frustrating. On the other hand, 1 advantage DKC2 has is that it’s better @ balancing its levels gimmicks & giving them a break, while DKC3 is mo’ straightforward ’bout having entire levels be dedicated to their gimmicks & nothing else. DKC2 was also mo’ consistent ’bout letting you ne’er stop while timing movement & cannon shots ( yeah, sorry I ne’er mentioned that yet, raocow — you ne’er had to stop for any o’ those bees in those mine levels ), while DKC3 does oft make you wait on projectiles. I will mention specifics when we get there. From what I’ve seen, DKC1 & 2 speedrunners oft playfully mock DKC3 for being comparatively slow, including during the 2014 AGDQ run o’ DKC3.

That said, sometimes DKC3 can actually be too consistent in ways that bring it down. For example, raocow mentions how Koin is just the same puzzle o’er & o’er with slight changes. & yet Koin is a cool idea that DKC2 ne’er thought o’. An improvement would've been to have Koin as a rare puzzle to get the hero coin on some levels & have other ways to get the coin on other levels. & sometimes gimmicks are just “dodge moving projectiles”. If DKC3 were mo’ consistent in being creative, I’d probably prefer it to DKC2. As it stands, it ties with being as inconsistent in level creativity & being less consistent in quality & artistic creativity.

But it’s better than DKC1 & the Returns games, which have much less creativity than both ( ’cept for visual creativity from Tropical Freeze ).
Xenesis wrote: To be honest, I would have thought raocow would be a bigger fan of "Donkey Kong Country: Canada"
I'm torn on level settings. Being objective, DKC2 has much mo’ creative level themes, like bee hives, carnivals, & bramble mazes in the sky. DKC3 is mostly forests, caves, water, & factories, which have already been done in the 1st DKC game. The only new themes are the harbor, mill, & waterfall levels, & the harbor & waterfall themes aren’t that rare in video games & mills are just wooden factories. On the other hand, on a not-objective-@-all perspective, as someone who lives just below Canada in the same “pacific northwest”, I absolutely adore DKC3’s cascade mountains & forests.

I also think DKC3’s music is underrated & that Eveline Novakovic in general is underrated. In particular, I think the forest music, which is coming later, is the best forest theme in any video game & easily beats out “Forest Interlude” ( Sadly, the GBA version replaces it with saccharine nonsense music ). To be fair, forest music seems to be her strength, as she also did the forest themes in the 1st game. & I can’t be the only one who adores “Enchanted Riverbank”, “Hot Pursuit”, & “Cascade Capers”.

If we’er talking ’bout theming & tone, honestly, I think this is 1 thing the 1st game did best & is 1 thing that’s missing from these 2 games. The 1st game had a hilarious faux-seriousness in its solemnness ( that some people I think call “dark”, for some reason ) that seems common in British humor, & part o’ that was helped by the 1st game’s mo’ atmospheric music. For instance, 1 thing I miss from the 1st game is the lack o’ death music when you fall in a pit — there’s just a solemn balloon pop. Then you have the temple music with their serious background music & menacing tick-tick-tick o’ the spinning stone wheels only for them to have tiny beavers inside o’ them or the menacing buzz o’ bees in the middle o’ realistic woods, only for those bees to have cartoonish bug eyes. DK himself as a photorealistic gorilla with a tie running round grabbing bananas was a mix o’ serious & silly. DKC2’s fantasy theme kinda ruined this — it took what was a cartoon comically failing to pretend to not be a cartoon & made it just a genuine cartoon. DKC3, thanks to its atmospheric music, sometimes comes halfway there, but fails in other ways. For 1, replacing Zinger with those stupid mechanical bees was a horrible idea. The Zingers were amazing in their uncanny-valley splendor; Buzzers are just generic cartoon enemies. But in a way, DKC3’s mix o’ seriousness & cartoony enemies makes it weirder & a bit mo’ interesting, while DKC2’s consistent fantasy tone was ne’er that interesting. Also, ¿how could DKC2 truly be that consistent with its pirate theme when it had bee hive levels & bramble mazes in the sky? ¿What do those have to do with pirates?
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Re: Donkey Kong Country 3 - Welcome to Kanada!

Postby Kilgamayan » 1 month ago

So much for my guess that the video title theme was "Rejected Mega Man X Maverick Names".
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