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All The S@nics & Knockles - 3&K - Angel

this is the place where lps are being talked about. it's important to talk about games being played on the internet.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby xfix » 4 months ago

IMO, go with one act per video, I sorta feel the issue is mostly due to the original Sonic having short levels, and this will correct itself in future games.

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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Validon98 » 4 months ago

To echo my thoughts from elsewhere, at first I was thinking one zone a video might be for the better, but then I was reminded about how a lot of future games go. One act per video might not seem like much now, but later on it'll be a lot more given that as the series has gone on, act length goes up. Add in longer/more involved special stages, cutscenes, and what-have-you, and one act a day will be of considerable length. It isn't now, true, but it will be eventually.

Granted, I don't really mind what happens in the end, but at the same time, it's up to raocow. Dude's already doing two other LPs on top of this, and I dunno about anyone else, but recording and cutting and uploading all that isn't nothing. I'd rather that if he were to change his mind on how to do the series, it's in reaction to how the games themselves are shaking out while playing them, rather than because the videos are too short for some people.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby kitikami » 4 months ago

raocow wrote: jokes on you metropolis was surprisingly easy!

though I haven't been able to find six song titles with labyrinth in the name within the single year of 1991, spoilers
Here's a list of 1991 releases containing songs with "Labyrinth" in the title: https://www.discogs.com/search/?type=al ... &year=1991

Most of them are just called "Labyrinth" but it appears there are at least 6 unique song titles. If you're desperate you could always go with "STH1 Labyrinth Zone" for one as well since it is technically a song from 1991.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby warpio » 4 months ago

Personally, I like the idea that Sonic videos can sometimes take almost no time out of your day, and that could likely mean during those "short Sonic level" downtime days you will be allowed extra time to be more risky with "1-more-leveling" in your A-side or B-side videos when you're in the mood to keep playing those games.

That's probably the angle I would go from if I wanted to convince my audience that 1-act-per-day is the best way to go with the C-side format, because that's probably easier to swallow as a justification in the perspective of a casual viewer who just cares about getting their daily let's play fix than the artistic/joke reason for doing 1-act-per-day.

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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby raocow » 4 months ago

well for what it's worth, I went ahead and recorded the entirety of the world for tonight's video to see how it feels. Ultimately I think the truth is that each game is too different that I think it's unwise to decide one thing for the whole series, at this point.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Rockythechao » 4 months ago

To clarify my earlier post, when I said "with a reassurance that you'll switch to zones once it's starting to drag for you" I didn't mean it would necessarily start to drag soon. Maybe instead of "once" I should've specified "if".

I'm personally worried that fatigue will start to set in before the end of the classic games, but if it doesn't I don't care if you per-act the entire franchise. Or, if you do switch to zones but then find yourself wanting to switch back to acts later -- as others are saying, the levels do get longer the further you get into the series -- there's no harm in that either. As long as you're moving at a pace that feels comfortable for you I'm good with whatever.

All I'm saying is, I've never been a fan of you prioritizing viewers' expectations or rigid playstyle limits like no savestates, 100% completion, video structure, etc. over yourself. Do what feels natural for you and for the game you're playing, and the rest should more or less fall into place.

Edit: so yeah basically what you already said while I was typing this post up
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dollop of Delicious Sour Cream

Postby Awoo » 4 months ago

raocow wrote: well for what it's worth, I went ahead and recorded the entirety of the world for tonight's video to see how it feels. Ultimately I think the truth is that each game is too different that I think it's unwise to decide one thing for the whole series, at this point.
If the videos are too short, maybe upload more than one act per day but still keep the format as "one-act-per-vid"?
That's my two cents. It's 100% up to you and I'll continue to support and watch you whatever you decide :catplanet:
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Grounder » 4 months ago

At this point, I just kind of want to know if we're going with Sanics or Sonics.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby FPzero » 4 months ago

Please don't suggest that he uploads even more videos every day, that feels unreasonable. Personally I think I'd rather go with the one video per act structure because the videos are small, bite-sized chunks, and will very quickly start getting longer. I'm not looking forward to all of Metropolis Zone in one video, for instance. I think it just looks bad right now because Green Hill Zone's acts are very fast and short. Yeah, it'll take a lot of time to get through the Genesis games but who's counting?

Let's just take our time. There's plenty of other video content coming out of this channel every day. Having a nice short video before bed is much easier to digest than the 20+ minute behemoths I sometimes saw uploaded for AtMM.

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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Money » 4 months ago

Grounder wrote: At this point, I just kind of want to know if we're going with Sanics or Sonics.
I think Sanics are the one shot games and Sonics are the actual complete playthroughs?

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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby raocow » 4 months ago

Money wrote:
Grounder wrote: At this point, I just kind of want to know if we're going with Sanics or Sonics.
I think Sanics are the one shot games and Sonics are the actual complete playthroughs?
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Implo » 4 months ago

To be honest I like the current format: 1 act per video, because it creates shorter videos (at least now). These short videos are really nice breather after other long videos (currently it's just JUMP HALF), but if raocow starts some Metroidvania game like La Mulana, then it will be 20+ min of A side + 30+ min of B side + 15+ min of C side per day. For me it's quite hard to watch that long videos per day.

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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby The Doctor » 4 months ago

I think the problem with the short videos for Sonic is that the early games are repetitive. We have about 20 2D Sonics that play the same and mostly look the same. Doing one act per video is just going to drag it out and people are going to get bored when after 6 months we've only just reached the 5th iteration of Green Hill Zone.

A series where the short videos would be fantastic is the WarioWare series. For those who don't know, these games are a collection of extremely short minigames that last about 5 seconds or less. One video per minigame would be hilarious because each game is totally different and zany. Sonic is just a poor fit for this style of video IMO.

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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby FourteenthOrder » 4 months ago

I'd rather raocow does what he would find most fun personally, though I feel like once we get to the games with hub areas it might be better to not stick 100% to the original thesis. Like, walking across the pool and entering Emerald Coast and stopping there would be hilarious, but I feel like doing that all across the whole game would become tiring quickly (also, for that matter, raocow would have to repeat that anyway when loading up the next day unless he does batch recordings). Obviously in the end it's up to raocow!
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby raocow » 4 months ago

me, setting up elaborate conditions without realising what it actually entails?! impossible
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Cyril » 4 months ago

Whimsical Calamari wrote: conceptually, per-act is definitely funny. like "hey guys here's a sonic video bye" gotta go fast

in execution? for the first sonic it actually leads to some pretty nice pacing, at least in the moment. future games, i don't know if it would fit, and it may make the introduction of longer, monolithic levels in later games just that much more jarring. but as of right now, i'm good with how it's going. like rocky said in the post above, keep to it for as long as you feel, and switch to per-zone when it starts dragging.

though i'm also in the "MM Zero videos were exhausting" camp, full disclosure. like, building the energy to watch those games' videos on a daily basis is one reason why i'm still catching up to the finale of AtMM.
yeah the zero/ZX videos were really hard to keep up with, i fell behind several times during those games

anyways raocow you said it was non-negotiable so don't negotiate, i personally don't really care either way whether it's per-act or per-zone

but when you get to something like, uhh, chaotix, good luck keeping it per zone
and colors, with its 5-acts-per-zone thingy
and lost world is 4-acts-per-zone and they can get long
and doing entire secret rings zones in one sitting would be absurd

i dunno
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby KobaBeach » 4 months ago

honestly yeah sonic wouldn't really fit for either act per video or zone per video since, like every game, length varies

but deep down...

as an adventure 1 fan, i just hope the toxic subset of adventure fans dont try to start shit when those two come up

see the replies of all of this for an example nevermind the fact Blaze has been a Sonic fan and a part of the online fandom since the 90s
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby ano0maly » 4 months ago

My input on the matter

It looks to me like on average, people are somewhat OK with one act per video, but it wasn't presented correctly. One act per video should because it's convenient for you and it's the most natural way to play as far as these "rules" go, if such a rule is even necessary. Not because of some joke that some of us are already not finding all that funny. And peeps are saying that the gimmick and its joke may eventually become tiring, for the audience and for the player himself, and that's when it might be a good time to deviate from it.

(I want to remind us that we previously came close to having this situation in ATMM with Powered Up Challenge Mode. If he applied one level per day there that would have been 100 videos on that one game (90 if he still skipped bosses), sometimes less than a minute long. He was convinced to make an exception there.)
Whimsical Calamari wrote: though i'm also in the "MM Zero videos were exhausting" camp, full disclosure. like, building the energy to watch those games' videos on a daily basis is one reason why i'm still catching up to the finale of AtMM.
FPzero wrote: Let's just take our time. There's plenty of other video content coming out of this channel every day. Having a nice short video before bed is much easier to digest than the 20+ minute behemoths I sometimes saw uploaded for AtMM.
Cyril wrote: yeah the zero/ZX videos were really hard to keep up with, i fell behind several times during those games
I really don't get the complaints about long AtMM videos. From what I remember, most of these cases are where he did stick to one level per video and the given level was just simply that long. Many of these levels were final levels with boss refights, extended final boss, cutscenes, and credits all bundled into one. You can't really split that, unless you save state after the boss refights or split the play session into multiple videos over multiple days. It's just natural for it to be that long.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Grounder » 4 months ago

^^that reminds me

why sega decided to make knuckles' and rouge's levels actively worse to play in adventure 2 just baffles me

like, you had the radar working just fine the first time for all three objects, why you gotta break it now?
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Chirei » 4 months ago

I didn't expect a ton of people to be against per act. I just expected this to be like a cooldown period where raocow plays a little sonic in between everything else as a break - it's gonna get tough again later.

I am not against it being like the mario format where he plays enough to where a video isn't too short, which a whole zone should do. Just as long as it is manageable with the current menu of games.

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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby BobisOnlyBob » 4 months ago

ano0maly wrote: I really don't get the complaints about long AtMM videos. From what I remember, most of these cases are where he did stick to one level per video and the given level was just simply that long. Many of these levels were final levels with boss refights, extended final boss, cutscenes, and credits all bundled into one. You can't really split that, unless you save state after the boss refights or split the play session into multiple videos over multiple days. It's just natural for it to be that long.
I don't think that's a complaint with the format, just a complaint with the physical reality of that much content and the games themselves! As you said, they were hard to break up into more digestible chunks by almost any set of recording guidelines. If you're like me and watch all three daily uploads, sometimes it could mean upwards of an hour to an hour and a half of content daily! Which I'm not knocking on principle, but it was genuinely hard to schedule around, especially when the alternatives were skipping episodes or dropping a side (and I will not deny I made liberal use of 1.5x speed during the latter X titles). But even when that's how each episode "naturally" gets made, you still gotta make time in the day to watch 'em, and not everyone has the luxury of a long lunch break or a commute where they can watch videos.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby KobaBeach » 4 months ago

Grounder wrote: ^^that reminds me

why sega decided to make knuckles' and rouge's levels actively worse to play in adventure 2 just baffles me

like, you had the radar working just fine the first time for all three objects, why you gotta break it now?
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I get walkers realistically control differently than killer robots but im sure there's a way to make controlling a mech feel fun and responsive without making it clunky and unbearable to play (though level design likely factors in that, a lot of Tails/Egg was corridors)

I haven't played like Armored Core or Mechwarrior or anything so I'm not the prime source for mech controls in games
Virtual On's controls aren't exactly something that would work in Sonic Adventure's gameplay mechanics after all
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dollar General

Postby Awoo » 4 months ago

KobaBeach wrote: I get walkers realistically control differently than killer robots but im sure there's a way to make controlling a mech feel fun and responsive without making it clunky and unbearable to play (though level design likely factors in that, a lot of Tails/Egg was corridors)

I haven't played like Armored Core or Mechwarrior or anything so I'm not the prime source for mech controls in games
Virtual On's controls aren't exactly something that would work in Sonic Adventure's gameplay mechanics after all
Completely off-topic:
raocow playing Armored Core, MechWarrior 2/Mercenaries or something like Steel Battalion when? That'd be neat

Had a friend back in the day who had Steel Battalion, that controller is something to behold. Shame that it's so extremely expensive these days...
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby KobaBeach » 4 months ago

I saw the Game Center CX episode on Steel Battalion and I was stunned honestly.
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Re: All The Sanics - 1 - Dusting Doilies Since 1991

Postby Bean » 4 months ago

Said it on YT, but I'll say it here and try to condense it.

Personally, I do like the zone per video idea unless you have trouble with a particular act. There's no reason to do 20 minute videos for this. Nope. Maybe do it like the Mario stuff that way!

It's just that there are so many stages in these games that you'd be spending weeks on one game at a time when the Mega Mans were usually done at most within 10-19 days outside of a couple of exceptions. Right off the bat, Sonic 1 would last as long as your longest Mega Man series that didn't have a gaiden or two playthroughs!

I still want you to do it your way for the time being if that's what you really want to do though! I haven't seen as many comments as you apparently have against the format, so I hope you're holding up okay either way!


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