All the S@nics - the end

[Slit08]

I mean the fact that it'll take a long while and has a ton of games is kind of the point. Megaman and sonic are second and third in terms of 'ip with the most games', behind only mario. that's part of the reason why I chose to do this.

a lot of the weirder, doesn't go anywhere games will have a one-shot video in the style of the 'postgame' of atmm. Which games I decide are worth a full playthrough vs only a one-shot is up to me making arbitrary decisions.

There's long LPs and dragging LPs out for the sake of a joke, IMO. It's not going to be so funny when it's been three months and we've barely finished both Sonic 2s.

Yeah, I totally agree with Grounder here. 1 Act per video is really dragging it out. Looking back at your Megaman series and how it started with Megaman 1 I notice that most of these videos took 5 to 6 minutes. That's about the length of a typical Zone including all acts with few exceptions in the classic game era (Marble Garden Zone, Sandopolis Zone to name two longer Zones). As I mentioned each Zone is one cohesive unit and it's weird to see three 1 minute videos (if not less) for each Act of Green Hill Zone.

Also many LPs or walkthroughs of Sonic games have 1 Zone per video since it makes sense similiar to how you play one Robot Master per video.

I would really think about this part again. As I said don't expect long videos with 1 Zone per video. They're still totally fine that way in terms of length but at least this way these episodes have some meat to them instead of almost no substance. :) Just saying... still your decision of course.

[KobaBeach]

i want to believe tomorrow is

rad mobile, arcade version

The problem with the fanbase that made the franchise a redheaded stepchild was (...) teenagers who basically used Sonic and its anthropomorphic settings as a creative outlet for their hormonal instabilities/insecurities and their social isolation because they were nerds and/or socially inept/awkward.

ah yes i too hate mentally ill, likely autistic children who use their interests as a creative outlet, i love seeing them suffer

why cant they be normal people like me /sarcasm

As an addendum to what Hiroshi said, a lot of the thing with Sonic, and by extent, Pokémon and furry in general, is that it also attracts a lot of neurodivergent children who have trouble developing social skills, which is why a lot of people joke that "Sonic is for autists and cringy" and not just that "grown adults who act like idiots in children's fanbases are idiots". Like it says something if the first thing you blame for Sonic's failure is ~the cringy teenagers~.

Makes you wonder if a lot of negative sentiment against Sonic's fandom (and a lot of cringe culture, in fact) isn't just veiled ableism :thonk:

Anyway I left the Sonic fanbase because Sega refused to learn from anything ever as seen with Boom (the games, cartoon is pretty good) and I still contend that Mania is a complete fluke (a good one at that, so more for me) caused entirely by enlisting fans who actually knew how the fuck Sonic worked and weren't just throwing shit at the wall because Sega refuses to let Sonic Team develop literally anything else, causing fatigue and burnout.

I have a complicated history with Sonic, if you can't tell.

[BobisOnlyBob]

I have a complicated history with Sonic, if you can't tell.

y'ain't the only one for sure, but I can only look forward to how much we're all gonna butt heads (hopefully productively, not unpleasantly) over some of the... variance in our preferences with regard to this beleaguered yet fascinating series.

[KobaBeach]

I have a few hot takes about all the 3D games post Adventure but I'm not gonna start shit because I don't want to bother people with my stupid opinions and also there's a difference between actually criticizing media constructively and just flat out letting people enjoy games (cue the adam ellis comics)

I'm not gonna act like people who like X game have to turn on their game consoles again and "face the music" because they're not allowed to like games, that's just being, in less than savory terms, a grade A bitch boy

Let me enjoy Romancing SaGa, Sonic Adventure and Pokémon Red, I say. I know they're bad and have glaring issues, you still can't stop me from having fun.

[FPzero]

@HiroshiMishima: You and I have got to stop meeting like this Good to see you again.

I didn't watch any of AtMM because Mega Man as a series has never really interested me and I never grew up with or played them over the years. You could argue maybe I should've watched since I never intended to play them all for myself, but one way or another the point still stands that I didn't really touch them. But with Sonic, I've played most of them by now. I didn't grow up with a Genesis, but I started with SA2 on Gamecube and loved it. So I gradually played most of the other games. I'll probably be watching this series quite a bit.

I'm of two minds here about the one act per video declaration. On one hand, considering how fast Sonic plays, some of these videos could be as short as 2 minutes which seems like it'd be really bad. But on the other hand, raocow puts out 3 videos from 3 different games every day. I can't really fault him if he wants to make his 3rd series videos into really short affairs that he barely has to worry about setup and recording for. Yeah it will mean this project will stretch on for quite a long time (Sonic 1 will be at least 18 videos) and yes I think that doing a full zone structure for the classic style games would be better, but ultimately it's his choice in the matter and he's got plenty of other content to record, edit, and upload every day. Plus these videos come out at like midnight my time. I can spare a couple minutes better than I can 20 minutes to watch a video before going to bed.

[Arctangent]

i'm looking forward to the hundreds of like 30 second episodes spent on sonic battle

[Blivsey]

raocow is going to make a sonic OC and there is absolutely nothing anyone can do to stop this

Any amount of wait will be worth that.

[Arctangent]

belatedly,

Let me enjoy Romancing SaGa, Sonic Adventure and Pokémon Red, I say. I know they're bad and have glaring issues, you still can't stop me from having fun.

i know full well i can't and don't want to anyway, but this will never erase the fact that rhyhorn and especially moltres's gen 1 learnset will always be one of my favorite things to rant about

[The Doctor]

Well here's my take on the one act per video issue. With 3 raocow videos a day it's hard to complain about the Sonics going slow, but at the same time I just don't get the point. Why go for super short one act per videos instead of a standard length video by doing one zone per video? It's especially weird because the 3D sonics will result in much longer videos. I'm fine with it if that's what raocow wants to do, but I'm confused.

[Kilgamayan]

Since people are confused, I'm almost certain that the game raocow will be playing first is

Flicky

, unless I have a knowledge gap

You should be correct. Pretty sure he confirmed in the patappon spotzone months ago that would be game #1.

Also, note that discussion on AtS has happened for months now in the patapon spotzone (maybe even a year), so any questions may have already been answered, or discussion already been had.

(If you're not a patron, seriously consider joining. you only need a minimum of $1.)

I get that there are by-design certain benefits to being a patreon versus not being a patreon but between the Mega Men, this series, and general B-side stuffs, it would be nice if the rest of us were sometimes made privy to at least some of this sort of information as it happens, instead of having conversations and attempts at theorizing more or less shut down because everything was hashed out months ago in a place we don't have access to reading.

[KobaBeach]

i know full well i can't and don't want to anyway, but this will never erase the fact that rhyhorn and especially moltres's gen 1 learnset will always be one of my favorite things to rant about

Same but it's how badly almost everything got downgraded from SA1 to SA2 to some extent, except like the Chao which had nothing but improvements. The thousands of people who like Adventure 2 are more than allowed to do so, their opinions are no less valid than my own, it's just that I just have a lot of personal issues with that game's design decisions lol

Hell, Knuckles levels can be a bit fun to me on occasion but that's only because I know their layouts and the best strategy to get high ranks in them to counter the gimped radar, except maybe Meteor Herd because fuck that stage.

Tails and Eggman are just too clunky and unfun to control with their delayed, more realistic tank-like movements compared to Gamma's brisk, breezy movement in the previous game. And Rouge's stages tend to be gimmicky in the bad ways.

Ironically Security Hall is the one I like the most out of her stages because it sacrifices a lot of bullshit (sub sections separated by a turtle object, a giant fuck you beetle, ｍａｄ　ｓｐａｃｅ) for a honestly still pretty bad time trial gimmick that I can live with somehow, because I've already played the stage numerous times to learn my way through it.

I also didn't really grow up with a Gamecube, all my love for Sonic Adventure derives from Dreamcast emulators and the 2004 PC port of DX that I pirated. And Sonic Adventure 2 emulation wouldn't be good enough until a bit into nullDC's life, due to a graphical bug that made it so shadows didn't appear, rendering King Boom Boo's battle nearly impossible and story mode impossible to complete (reach Last Story that is), without using a completed save file.

[Crow]

Heroes is the worst 3D sonic I've played personally but I haven't played 06
I have played secret rings and it's dangerously close though
Some of those missions are gonna be fun 30 second videos

[churine]

so, kind of important quesion for raocow

with "try to play the first version except when vastly easier to record", what is your stance of Sonic Adventure's Dreamcast restoration mod?

since the point of it is make it as close as possible to DC, but outright recording DC is difficult and the game got a heck of a lot changed from it

I think it'd be best to make the exception for this one case?

[SAJewers]

so, kind of important quesion for raocow

with "try to play the first version except when vastly easier to record", what is your stance of Sonic Adventure's Dreamcast restoration mod?

since the point of it is make it as close as possible to DC, but outright recording DC is difficult and the game got a heck of a lot changed from it

I think it'd be best to make the exception for this one case?

My understanding is that DC emulation isn't too bad nowadays thanks to reicast, and continuing to get better, so that may not be too bad.

EDIT: I posted this on the patapon spotzone 2 weeks ago, so I might as well post this here

https://www.reddit.com/r/emulation/comm ... og_series/

[Blivsey]

Heroes is the worst 3D sonic I've played personally but I haven't played 06
I have played secret rings and it's dangerously close though
Some of those missions are gonna be fun 30 second videos

Heroes was my first 3d Sonic so I'm biased and well aware of it, but how is Heroes's admittedly-poor handling worse than the game where you are actively fighting with your controller at all times

[churine]

My understanding is that DC emulation isn't too bad nowadays thanks to reicast, and continuing to get better, so that may not be too bad.

EDIT: I posted this on the patapon spotzone 2 weeks ago, so I might as well post this here

https://www.reddit.com/r/emulation/comm ... og_series/

I wonder if that will include VMU emulation so we can have Chao Adventure + Chao Adventure 2

[Crow]

Heroes is just flat not fun to play. It's more a lack of positive qualities than anything
Secret rings at least could pretend to be fun sometimes but admittedly I haven't played it in a decade

What sucks is that both have killer soundtracks and great visual design but just. Miserable gameplay

[CrispyMWHC]

Heroes is just flat not fun to play. It's more a lack of positive qualities than anything

It might just be that this game was my "turn off your brain" game back when I was working 12 hour shifts, but I liked Heroes a lot.
No opinion on the Wii ones, though, never got around to them.

[Blivsey]

I disagree. Granted, Heroes can absolutely be miserable at times (pinball, rails, the special stages), but at least it's entirely controlled with reliable buttons and analog. Unlike Secret Rings, which plays like it's controlled with an arcade joystick with glitchy deadzones. And also has awful level design and physics.

I haven't played Secret Rings in years either, but that's because my first playthrough was a nightmare rather than just having a lack of positive qualities.

[ano0maly]

Personally I think it's unnecessary to stick to one act per video or one zone per video. If he stops after one act in a given day it should be because he's had enough for the day, not because he feels he's forced to stick to the rule. I would say it's fine to just play naturally and stop once he feels he should. He doesn't strictly do one level a day with Mario, even for something like contests.

ATMM began with the classic games that had sort of had the same structure, which is why there were stipulations to spice up revisiting old classics. But as he played games that started to deviate from the formula, like Zero and ZX, those self-imposed rules began to loosen a little bit (like the time he ran off to an extra mission in ZX). And there were videos where he faced an impasse and couldn't complete the allotted level of the day (as happened during Network Transmission and X Legacy Challenges). This shows that the need to have a rigid structure may not have as much of a purpose as it was once thought to have when he was just thinking of doing MM1-10.

[Super Llama]

raocow is going to make a sonic OC and there is absolutely nothing anyone can do to stop this

Any amount of wait will be worth that.

Demo the Hedgeclops

[Duker]

everything was hashed out months ago in a place we don't have access to reading.

And that place is raocow's brain... It's ultimately his rules that he decided, being there for the minor additional input he got along the way does not change much if anything.

[Leet]

Also, note that discussion on AtS has happened for months now in the patapon spotzone (maybe even a year), so any questions may have already been answered, or discussion already been had.

(If you're not a patron, seriously consider joining. you only need a minimum of $1.)

Supporting raocow is a cool and nice thing to do on its own but I'm not interested in abandoning the talkhaus for the premium membership talkhaus (or any other discord)

[Mata Hari]

Honestly Heroes is the best Sonic just cos you can hear knuckles shouting SHIT! FUCK! NNUEGHH! over and over again

also could we please change the title to 'All The Sonicmen'

[Katazuki]

I have been summoned from the graveyard.


In other words, one act per video is gonna leave us with a lot of 1-2 minute videos for the first few Sanics. OH BOYE. I think the one act rule should vary depending on the game, like for example maybe once you get into the 3D Sonics, then yeah, one act per video could absolutely fly. But in the classic Sonics, it's gonna take a pretty long time to get through them all if you do them one act at a time. If you want to do it that way though, more power to ya.

With that said though, I don't think you addressed this in the video, but what's going to be the completion criteria? Just a casual run? All Chaos Emeralds at minimum? All the Red Rings and Emblems? (I sure hope not for the latter)