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Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

this is the place where lps are being talked about. it's important to talk about games being played on the internet.
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tangy
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by tangy »

i wish <map></map> html image maps worked here. they would make everything a lot easier
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Zach808 »

Seeing this game again makes me wonder: Could the Wario Land series be what inspired Mario Odyssey all along? That game certainly seems to have built on the “using enemy transformations to progress” gameplay, only with it being 3D Mario instead.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by J. J. W. Mezun »

008. N3 The Vast Plain - Red

Mossy cave ~
allergies act up...
minigolf.


009. W3 The Pool of Rain - Gray

Quiet morn ~
swimming serenely
wooden poles.


010. W4 A Town in Chaos - Gray

Brisk evening ~
in town bears give me
cold shoulder.

---------------------------------------
tangeruse wrote: 5 years ago
J. J. W. Mezun wrote: 5 years ago ol'
'gain
e'en
'splain
li'l
'bout
o'
'cause
o'er
You don't have to use as few syllables as possible when typing. Your insightful wario land 3 comments are not the u.s. national anthem
I have no idea what you're talking 'bout. I ne'er wrote that incoherent poem you libeliously quoted me s'posedly saying. You must be mistaking me for T.S. Eliot 'gain.

Also, I have yet to say anything insightful.
Paragraph wrote: 5 years agoThe golf minigame is insanely annoying. It's not too hard to get "good" at it, but it's never FUN.
This is 100% objective fact.
SAJewers wrote: 5 years agoIf a game downright requires you to read the manual to teach you something, then the developer has done a bad job in either explaining it or making it simple to understand, since it's wholly possible for the player to not have the manual when they play it.
To be fair, this is a modern standard. Back then 'twas considered standard practice to expect players to read the manual before playing. ¿Why else have an instruction manual if it's not meant for instruction? Also, I can imagine Nintendo only cared 'bout the players who bought the game new with all the environment-killing packaging & Nintendo Power ads. A'least Nintendo didn't demand raocow put in an arbitrary password kept in the manual, like much older games oft did.

People oft complain 'bout "Yell @ raocow the monitor" syndrome, but I'm pleasantly surprised raocow only had to go outside that gray key room 2 times before he figured out how to 'scape the gray key room. I haven't seen such good puzzle-solving since Tom Sawyer figured out how to free Jim @ the end o' Adventures of Huckleberry Finn.

As for the poles in "The Pool of Rain", I distinctly remembered being stumped by those when I 1st played that level. It's a fresh blast o' nostalgia seeing someone play this for the 1st time like I did as a kid, which I can't do now, since I have this entire game burned into my memory.

However, though I've played this game a'least a dozen times, I've ne'er seen that glitch with the pole appearing partly underwater. Also, the poles usually reset after you fall into the water, which is why the camera moves awkwardly down like that ( to hide the poles warping back into their original places ), but that didn't seem to happen a few times raocow fell into the water. This & what must've been the buttered-up surface o' those poles that caused raocow to fall in the water every time I breathed leads me to think he has 1 o' those badly dumped roms with ice-skating Link that will end 70% through the game with an antipiracy message.

Useless speedrun tip for those stoves that everyone can ignore:

you can shove them faster by turning 'way from them, charge attacking, & then turning toward them just after.

It makes perfect sense.

Mo' useful speedrun tip that everyone can definitely ignore:

you can perform an important sequence break o' getting the red key & chest @ this point by using some hard-to-pull-off ( speedrunners pause-and-save-buffer to do it, & it usually takes many tries ) glitch by squeezing Wario into the stove @ the bottom o' the Zambi room when it's gainst the wall, corrupting the room so that you can get past the cracked block blocking the rest o' the upper path.

Wenn alle stehen bleiben und anstarren
und sagen, <¿Warum musst du so sein?>,
schaue ich ihnen einfach in die Augen
und sage ihnen, dass ich von Fledermäusen aufgezogen wurde.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Nimono »

You know, I'm now questioning WHY they expected you to hit the switch and leave that area the way you came in, when it's clearly easier to just get zombified and leave through the bottom path.

By the way, more fun-fact spoilers. Read at your own risk!
That bottom area is key to the any% speedrun of this game. For some reason if you smash the stove and slide at it, you can clip into it. Do it enough and hit it from within (and mostly on the other side), you get sent to a super-glitched version of the area. at this point, zombies will spawn in the lower area and you can use this to cliiiiiimb. Utilizing the wall clip glitch I mentioned last time, you can get yourself stuck in the wall on the right (you won't be able to visibly see it, though), then get zombified and repeatedly jump- this will send you upward. then, fall through a platform, and hey, now you can go through that door on the bottom-right. This will let you get the treasure there much, much, MUCH earlier than intended, and this utterly breaks the game's sequence because THIS treasure unlocks levels on its own! But beware- you weren't intended to visit the levels it unlocks until after you gained the ability to swim! Meaning to clear that next level, you need to use a lot of wall clipping...and I still haven't managed to figure out how to do it in that level!
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Sebby19 »

Updated the flowchart. Not posting it again here, don't see the need today.

Just added today's treasures, and added the Crayons (brown square) to the flowchart's Legend. The crayons are part of a special Treasure Set, and getting them all will unlock whatever is in the mountain. Rao can check how many there are in the in-game treasure list.


@Nimono: That switch DOES serve a purpose. It will be more apparent later on, but this isn't a case of weird level design.
What I DO find weird that that one intersection on the North side of the world, in between 'Out of this Woods', 'Peaceful Village', and 'The Vast Plain'. This is the ONLY instance of it in the game. I've wondered for a while why they didn't just make a straight path from N1->N2->N3, like they did with 'The Pool of Rain' and 'A City in Chaos', two back-to-back levels that were unlocked at the same time.

My only guess why they put a branched path there was to have the game subtly say "Hey, you can go in either direction!". The other way probably would have lead to more players just choosing N2 first.
Still weird there is only one instance of this.
Last edited by Sebby19 5 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Nimono »

Sebby19 wrote: 5 years ago

@Nimono: That switch DOES serve a purpose. It will be more apparent later on, but this isn't a case of weird level design.

I don't think we should discuss these outside spoiler tags, Sebby... I know it holds a purpose for W4 Red, but for W1 Gray, it's pointless, there's already another exit. Also the thing about the crayons should be put in spoiler tags, imo, because it hasn't been shown yet. It's merely raocow's hypothesis so far.

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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by FPzero »

I just figured the switch might be used to get out of those rooms in the daytime, since I'm not sure if the zombies will spawn there if it's day. It's been too long since I played the game last for me to remember if this is the case or not.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Ashan »

This game was the first time I saw the word "chaos" and I assumed it was pronounced "chows"
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Ometeotl »

J. J. W. Mezun wrote: 5 years ago
I refuse to believe you are an actual person
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Voltgloss »

Ometeotl wrote: 5 years ago
J. J. W. Mezun wrote: 5 years ago
I refuse to believe you are an actual person
https://mega-microstories.com/2014/10/0 ... j-w-mezun/
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Sebby19 »

@Nimono: I interpreted your first post as meaning you haven't played the game before.
And I needed a good segue into my mini-rant about the weird intersection.

Since no one has commented on the backgrounds for the Boss and Golf treasures, I'm assuming they look fine to everyone.

As for what Alice asked on the 1st page (treasures to link to specific timestamps), I thought about it some for. I think for sanity's sake, I won't have timestamps, for now. Just look at what I see when gluing this thing together:

Code: Select all

[img]https://i.imgur.com/NN2zAM6.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/X7b2RyC.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GS4EegW9UE][img]https://i.imgur.com/x17bTS7.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/2WE9GH7.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/KzIj3aQ.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/Aconfwi.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GS4EegW9UE][img]https://i.imgur.com/EfkAI3o.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/faRcOmU.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GBonOXVLSI][img]https://i.imgur.com/UWN7hUF.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/SHCgLlC.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/8i1IIFr.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/W9si803.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GBonOXVLSI][img]https://i.imgur.com/s8EqXhK.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/faRcOmU.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GBonOXVLSI][img]https://i.imgur.com/4D4ArUw.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/SHCgLlC.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/0MgbmBi.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/YMXARw1.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=td__soTeW20][img]https://i.imgur.com/MzyAPmy.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/2WE9GH7.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/j8BZW8p.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/zmPiwpw.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=td__soTeW20][img]https://i.imgur.com/ECIFofk.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/faRcOmU.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv0lBvlZRFY&t=0s][img]https://i.imgur.com/TpZBGDT.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/SHCgLlC.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/uGmbAv8.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/hewrM72.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv0lBvlZRFY&t=0s][img]https://i.imgur.com/7SpHs71.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/faRcOmU.png[/img][url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv0lBvlZRFY&t=0s][img]https://i.imgur.com/sWH4NzV.png[/img][/url][img]https://i.imgur.com/2WE9GH7.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/7R3VZIY.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/4USwPru.png[/img][img]https://i.imgur.com/rNEJYwC.png[/img][img]https://i.imgur.com/SGN8KUA.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/VMrAxUI.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/8voConL.png[/img]
Let me just keeps things as least messy as possible.

But I WILL put timestamps in if several people state they would like it.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Leet »

Ometeotl wrote: 5 years ago
J. J. W. Mezun wrote: 5 years ago
I refuse to believe you are an actual person
Bizarrely, they are and I'm actually familiar with their very old work from the old internet. I think most of it doesn't exist anymore. Also it was not written like this at all.
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Alice »

Sebby19 wrote: 5 years agoAs for what Alice asked on the 1st page (treasures to link to specific timestamps), I thought about it some for. I think for sanity's sake, I won't have timestamps, for now. Just look at what I see when gluing this thing together:
That's completely fair. Bbcode can get really damned messy for larger posts, especially if you're doing something like that image.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Griflion »

Leet wrote: 5 years ago
Ometeotl wrote: 5 years ago
J. J. W. Mezun wrote: 5 years ago
I refuse to believe you are an actual person
Bizarrely, they are and I'm actually familiar with their very old work from the old internet. I think most of it doesn't exist anymore. Also it was not written like this at all.
If i saw this right some days ago, J. J. W. Mezun, actually owns warioland3.com , so i guess that still exists
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Sebby19 »

Griflion wrote: 5 years ago If i saw this right some days ago, J. J. W. Mezun, actually owns warioland3.com , so i guess that still exists
That's right! I've seen those same contractions on that on that other site. I found it while looking for reference material for the map. But the site was done in such a way that I couldn't right-click->save target as any of the images!
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Griflion »

Sebby19 wrote: 5 years ago
Griflion wrote: 5 years ago
That's right! I've seen those same contractions on that on that other site. I found it while looking for reference material for the map. But the site was done in such a way that I couldn't right-click->save target as any of the images!
You could just checked the source code and found this link pretty easily
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Ashan »

Sebby19 wrote: 5 years ago
Griflion wrote: 5 years ago If i saw this right some days ago, J. J. W. Mezun, actually owns warioland3.com , so i guess that still exists
That's right! I've seen those same contractions on that on that other site. I found it while looking for reference material for the map. But the site was done in such a way that I couldn't right-click->save target as any of the images!
It's using CSS background images for the images.

In Chrome:
Right click -> Inspect
Then in the Elements tab there's a Styles section off to the right. There's a background-image CSS attribute with a relative URL. Right click the URL and open in new tab
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Sebby19 »

-Source Code: Would have never thought of that. I did find that exact image, elsewhere.
-Chrome: Don't have it, or use it. Only of IE and Edge, and I don't use Edge.
J. J. W. Mezun wrote:
So, sir, how did you find out about raocow, 2 long years ago?
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by SAJewers »

I'm going to assume from his WArio Land LP, which was two years ago.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by J. J. W. Mezun »

011. S1 The Grassland - Gray

Itchy grass ~
conspire, pink birds &
ceiling slime.


012. S2 The Big Bridge - Gray

The new bridge ~
tadpole jumps into
petrol sound.


013. S1 The Grassland - Red

New beanstalk ~
in cave walls, so pleased
lightning beams.


-------------------
Ometeotl wrote: 5 years ago
J. J. W. Mezun wrote: 5 years ago
I refuse to believe you are an actual person
You can't prove a negative, so you're right to be skeptical.

Griflion wrote: 5 years ago If i saw this right some days ago, J. J. W. Mezun, actually owns warioland3.com , so i guess that still exists
Interestingly 'nough, not that long ago somebody contacted me 'bout buying warioland.com for $100. However, I haven't gotten back to them, since I'm not sure if I have that kind o' money for a domain for which I'm not e'en sure what I'd do with it. I don't have time nowadays to make fan contact for all the Wario Lands — I still haven't finished the Wario Land 3 website.

Sebby19 wrote: 5 years ago So, sir, how did you find out about raocow, 2 long years ago?
I've known 'bout raocow since 2010 or 2011 from the Something Awful LP o' The Second Reality Project: Reloaded. In 1 o' my many former lives, I was involved in SMW rom hacking.

-------------------

"The Grassland" is 1 o' the most annoying levels in this game, what with the holes in the ground that aren't indicated @ all, making walking through it essentially trial-&-error gameplay. The birds that inebriate Wario with the sheer force o' their aerial tackles are the least o' one's problems.
That level also has the most obscure music coin in the entire game. It'll be fun to see raocow try finding it.
This playthrough made me notice something I haven't noticed before: in 2 o' the 3 levels in which the beanstalk grows, the beanstalk grows in a cave. Those must be magical seeds, indeed, if they can grow such large vegetation without access to sunlight or rain. Clearly that's the most absurd part o' this otherwise rational game.
Wenn alle stehen bleiben und anstarren
und sagen, <¿Warum musst du so sein?>,
schaue ich ihnen einfach in die Augen
und sage ihnen, dass ich von Fledermäusen aufgezogen wurde.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Sebby19 »

The official name of 2nd treasure is indeed 'Magical Seed'

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Updated this portion of the flowchart. Things are starting to branch out now! Also added the Music Box (Blue Square) to the legend, since this Treasure Set is special.

Just to remind raocow (since he placed himself at The Volcano's Base [which is useless if he starts from the Title Screen]), you can review the last cutscene you saw, from the map.
The cutscene viewer is rather limited though, It only saves the LAST cutscene (so goodbye to the scene with the Magical Seed). If you decide to get a treasure on another path, like the other two treasure made available by the Magic Bean; or get a crayon, goodbye to the Truck Wheels scene.

Rao, if you really want to place a 'bookmark', so you don't forget, what can do is quickly enter the level, pause and SAVE. The game creates a temp save state that you can access right from the Title Screen
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Kitsune Zeta »

So if you've seen the 100% TAS for this game, you're probably wondering why it does a soft reset immediately after the autosave for getting the Magical Seed. Well, that has to do with a bug in one of the three levels the seed affects. For whatever reason, if you've been playing through the game in one sitting (or, in emulation, been using savestates),

attempting to get the treasure in W3 that is made available by the Magical Seed is impossible because the screen exit at the top of the beanstalk doesn't get set by the event properly.

Simply doing a soft reset is enough to fix it. This means it's very unlikely that the bug will show up in casual play.

Of course, given that raocow is in fact using the game's save system instead of savestates, I doubt this will affect him anyways.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Nimono »

Kitsune Zeta wrote: 5 years ago So if you've seen the 100% TAS for this game, you're probably wondering why it does a soft reset immediately after the autosave for getting the Magical Seed. Well, that has to do with a bug in one of the three levels the seed affects. For whatever reason, if you've been playing through the game in one sitting (or, in emulation, been using savestates),

attempting to get the treasure in W3 that is made available by the Magical Seed is impossible because the screen exit at the top of the beanstalk doesn't get set by the event properly.

Simply doing a soft reset is enough to fix it. This means it's very unlikely that the bug will show up in casual play.

Of course, given that raocow is in fact using the game's save system instead of savestates, I doubt this will affect him anyways.
Wait, WHAT!? That's a thing that happens!? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. I love it!

YOU WOULD THINK THE EXIT WOULD EXIST REGARDLESS!



Today we find a Music Box! This one amuses me because it's like the very first treasure you get, the Axe- all it does is on its own, unlock the very next level in the area you're in. Feels pointless! But ah well.
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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by Ditocoaf »

Yep, raocow, you discovered Wario's secret, in the game that's closest to being a genre of its own: he's a big wimp!

And yeah, I don't think invincibility was ever meant to make the game easier, it's just a gimmick to create this puzzle-y gameplay. You saw in the bridge today the penalty for one hit can be "restart the entire level", but to make up for it levels are kinda short.
Nimono wrote: 5 years ago
Wait, WHAT!? That's a thing that happens!? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. I love it!

YOU WOULD THINK THE EXIT WOULD EXIST REGARDLESS!

I think most changes to levels are made by swapping out screens with entire alternate versions. Like with the vine raocow climbed today, probably only the bottom screen had a both a vine version and a no-vine version -- the seed swapped it out. And the top exit would be disabled when the vine wasn't there, because you shouldn't be able to get up there anyway, and it'd show the top of the vine that doesn't exist yet.

If I had to guess, the data would be stored in a bunch of little files for each screen, and then another file that determines how they're all stitched together. You'd have to both tell the level file "connect (6,2) to (6,1) via upward scrolling" and swap screen b23298 for a10132 so the vine shows up.

So for the case you're talking about,

they probably just forgot to do both things with the seed cutscene, or there was a typo on that line or something. And they'd be even more careful when loading level-states from the title screen save file, so the mistake didn't happen there.

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Re: Wario Land 3 - With input from Samus

Post by FPzero »

Dizzy/Drunk Wario controls advice:
You can still use Left and Right to steer where Wario is gonna slowly stumble towards. Jumping makes him move faster, but only in the direction he's currently stumbling and he takes a moment after hitting the ground again to be able to change direction.
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