Mega Man - We're Here Forever!

Paragraph · Post by **Paragraph** » 5 years ago

The problem with special weapons is not just limited to this stage, but it's most obvious when you literally cannot use them. I like playing around with special weapons a lot, and it seems like you'd get a LOT of play with them spread out over three characters here, but there just aren't that many opportunities to do so. This is where the gimmicks hurt the game the most obviously, I think. Of the stages we've seen, two plain don't allow special weapons, one is almost entirely focused around platforming and its gravity gimmick (you can even kill many enemies WITH the gimmick), one is about stealth and avoiding fights and one is almost completely devoid of enemies in general.

You do have the kill rooms, but the special weapons rarely help; even stuff like homing shots just doesn't fire quickly enough to be worth it, you're better served blitzing/sabering them down with your standard attacks.
Also, the weapon set is simply not that interesting to use considering the enemies you're up against. Any enemy with a shield needs it broken with normal attacks. Often, you have dudes as obstacles complimenting the gimmick (bats in the pitch-black part of...uh...Pitch Black, lasergun guys in the vertical scrolling part of Inferno) which are themselves easily dealt with or best avoided. Weapons that take a while to deploy or to home in won't help at all, as do weapons limited to the ground/specific firing angles.

It's a bit of a shame because the set isn't bad, but I don't know where to even begin trying most of them out. Of course, there's like one or two situations per weapon where it's quite good, but it almost always seems incidental, not planned.

Chirei · Post by **Chirei** » 5 years ago

Paragraph wrote: ↑5 years ago The problem with special weapons is not just limited to this stage, but it's most obvious when you literally cannot use them. I like playing around with special weapons a lot, and it seems like you'd get a LOT of play with them spread out over three characters here, but there just aren't that many opportunities to do so.

Also when you get either of X's arm upgrades, the player will probably very quickly realize that there isn't a reason to use special weapons to beat the game, since the armors in this game are broke as hell.

Heavy Sigh · Post by **Heavy Sigh** » 5 years ago

I appreciate that the capsule was literally directly in front of raocow and he still walked straight past it.

MAVERICK FACTS! Insect Inhabiting Rich Mineral Deposits

"My master... New world... Space resources... Even a decaying pile of scrap like you can guess with that many hints, no?"

Earthrock Trilobyte, known as Earthrock Torirovich (アースロック・トリロビッチ Āsurokku Torirobicchi) in Japan, is a New Generation Reploid based on a trilobite.

Trilobyte was in charge of the various mines located in Metal Valley, which is rich in rare minerals essential to space development used by the Jakob Project. When he became a Maverick, he instigated an extremely violent rebellion in Metal Valley and gave the extracted minerals to Sigma. In the entrance of the warehouse, he tries to stop the Maverick Hunters with Crystal Walls before they can reach him.

ALTERNATE DIALOGUE

Trivia

After Earthrock Trilobyte's defeat, Crystal Walls will still appear in the entrance of the warehouse, but his voice is not heard. It is possible that the walls are used by an unseen, new generation Reploid copying him.

The Metal Valley stage is located in Alberta, Canada.

Paragraph · Post by **Paragraph** » 5 years ago

Heavy Sigh wrote: ↑5 years ago Trivia

After Earthrock Trilobyte's defeat, Crystal Walls will still appear in the entrance of the warehouse, but his voice is not heard. It is possible that the walls are used by an unseen, new generation Reploid copying him.

The Metal Valley stage is located in Alberta, Canada.

I've read (because how would I find out myself, honestly) that when you replay Dynasty (lol), Gigabolt is replaced by a new generation Reploid, making the stage not empty.

Crystal Wall is a fuck because you need it to get a few of the items that are hidden in the ground, with one of the least intuitive processes in any Mega Man. You have to first find a spot you find suspicious (note: spots may not actually be suspicious), then charge it up, use it on that spot, and the rare metal will pop out. It's really stupid. Of course, to do that, you need an arm part to even do the charge first...

Needless to say, the cleanup for this game will be a bit of an event. raocow, are you fine with getting heavy hints or do you want to look for yourself? After all, the game DOES tell you how many items you are missing per stage, but it's super unintuitive in many cases. Or do you maybe even remember where things are?

Post by **raocow** » 5 years ago

I don't remember anything so I might want heavier hints than usual, yeah

Post by **Bean** » 5 years ago

Oh geez. I just remembered how big that all is. In this case, it's probably going to be two vids' worth for sure if you're going after all those rare metals along with the capsules.

Ashan · Post by **Ashan** » 5 years ago

I don't know if X7 just scared you off of using Zero forever, but I don't think he's one to completely ignore in this game! He has decent damage output from his sword, it's not impossible to hit things because we're in 2D again, and the double jump if very useful (and I find it way easier to handle than Axl's weird hover that is very easy to trigger by accident)

LunarRainbowShyGuy · Post by **LunarRainbowShyGuy** » 5 years ago

This is an alright stage, though I wish the big robot would give you a bit more space before the rubber banding kicks in. Also, despite the operators telling you to hurry, there's no time limit on the way back through the stage, but considering there is a stage that kills you if you take too long I can't really blame you for thinking there might be one. I don't have much else to say about this stage other than that I like having Vile show up here if only because I find dodging the crystal walls to be pretty tedious.

As has been mentioned the charged crystal wall is required to find some upgrades, which is something I'm not a big fan of. When I first played this I actually managed to find most of the upgrades by myself, but there were some I just could not find no matter how many times I went through the stages. Eventually I looked at I guide, and with one exception all the upgrades I was having trouble finding involved using the charged crystal wall at certain locations.

FourteenthOrder · Post by **FourteenthOrder** » 5 years ago

This boss I remember pretty well, because I always found the patterns not very hard at all, yet super fun nonetheless for some reason. Considering how much I love brutally difficult bosses that's probably not the easiest balance to get for me, I feel like. ^^;

Chirei · Post by **Chirei** » 5 years ago

Since the Crystal Wall has been found and people are nodding toward its importance, it's about time for this.

Special Weapons

These will be colored the same way as specific upgrades to denote who they are for.

Blue - for X
Red - for Zero
Black - for Axl

Squeeze Bomb

Uncharged: Fires a dense, expanding gravity field forward that crushes enemies. Alright damage, decent range.

Charged: X becomes temporarily invincible and exerts a big gravity field across the screen that deletes all projectiles, but does NO damage. Basically a shmup screenclear bomb.

Thunder Dancer

Uncharged: X shoots a short-range bolt that chains toward nearby enemies if the initial bolt connects, shocking them for good damage.

Charged: The bolt is larger and chains towards more enemies.

Shadow Runner

Uncharged: X throws a black boomerang that spirals towards him.

Uncharged: X fires two boomerangs that spiral around.

Melt Creeper

Uncharged: X fires a wave of flame that creeps along the ground and scorches enemies. Can only be used on the ground.

Charged: X creates flame waves on both sides of him.

Drift Diamond

Uncharged: Shoots two bouncing snowflakes at diagonal angles. Does decent damage and freezes enemies.

Charged: X gets a swirling barrier of frost around him that is very similar to the charged Bubble Splash from X2. Also freezes enemies.

Crystal Wall

Uncharged: X makes a crystal stalagmite from the floor that impales an enemy under it, and can be used as a wall against some things. You can tip the crystal over to try to hit the enemy that way also.

Charged: X makes a slightly bigger crystal, but it has a random item inside. When used in certain locations, it will unearth Rare Metals instead. Basically X's equivalent of Rush Search.

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Juuhazan

Zero rears back a little, and then performs a huge overhead swing with the power of Gravity behind it. Breaks shields instantly.

Raikousen

Zero dashes, suddenly vanishes, and then reappears a few steps away with a lightning bolt cutting across the distance he teleported. Lot of delay on this move.

Rasetsusen

Zero spins rapidly in the air, continuing to spin for a while as long as the button is held. You have free control of Zero while he is performing this deadly move.

Enkoujin

Downward stabbing attack, enchanted with flame. It is basically Quake Blazer from X5 with less explosions.

Hyoryoushou

Zero swings his saber like a helicopter blade while rising, cutting and freezing enemies caught in its path.

Rekkyoudan

Zero's saber gets an orange tint, and is able to reflect certain projectiles on contact.

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Spiral Magnum

Axl gets large pistols that shoot heavy, armor-piercing rounds. Will break shields with extreme ease.

Plasma Gun

A powerful lightning gun that shoots out a wide branch of electricity. Good for closer-range affairs.

Black Arrow

Axl wields a black crossbow that shoots out bolts of darkness. The projectiles mercilessly arc downward, descending on the enemy.

Flame Burner

A flamethrower, that combined with Axl's omnidirectional aiming, can easily coat the whole screen in flames.

Ice Gattling

A gatling gun that rapidly fires chunks of ice instead of normal bullets. Also has a freezing effect.

Bound Blaster

A strange weapon that lets Axl fire large, bouncing projectiles that can easily overwhelm foes in close quarters.

Ashan · Post by **Ashan** » 5 years ago

Yeah so this was the first stage I went to in my playthrough of this game.
Have to say I'm not a huge fan of the level. It seemed to be the one where they wanted to really show off the ride armor, but the ride armor just feels like such a downgrade from your regular movement. Maybe as a kid I would have been like "oh wow cool I'm in the big mech suit" but as soon as I hopped into the thing I was like "wow this is horrible, I want my regular movement and abilities back." They even make you babysit it with the elevators and buttons to get it around, basically making the stage into an escort mission. Usually if you lose your armor, it's because of exactly what happened to raocow -- it makes you deposit it onto the bramble conveyor belt and then when you hop back into it on the other end it takes 3 hours for the animation of you getting into the armor and the thing standing up, and by the time you're in control it's already falling so you bail out while the armor falls into a pit. And the stage half-pretends you don't actually need the armor but then it throws you into a small room with 100 guys in ride armor where the intended method of getting through is still having your ride armor and mashing punch.

Heavy Sigh · Post by **Heavy Sigh** » 5 years ago

You can jump cancel the armor activation animation.

MAVERICK FACTS! FALLEN GIANT OF THE FOREST

Bamboo Pandamonium, known as Bamboo Pandemonium (バンブー・パンデモニウム Banbū Pandemoniumu, a one letter difference) in Japan, is a calm New Generation Reploid based on a giant panda.

Pandamonium was in charge of the rocket center in Booster Forest, a space research facility in China used before the Jakob Orbital Elevator was built. After it was deemed obsolete and abandoned, Pandamonium stayed at the facility. When he became a Maverick, he collected data on the rockets in the facility for Sigma. He believes the world wants to be destroyed, as its history has been spent making destructive things like missiles and Reploids, and likes Sigma's plan to create a new world.

ALTERNATE DIALOGUE!

Chirei · Post by **Chirei** » 5 years ago

repliod

Green Spinner

Uncharged: X fires a big, powerful rocket forward.

Charged: X shoots a rocket upwards that descends into a wide salvo of rockets.

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Yodantotsu

A quick, stabbing attack with some momentum behind it. Causes Zero to slide forward some.

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Blast Launcher

Axl runs around with a grenade launcher. What more is there to say?

Post by **Bean** » 5 years ago

The cool thing about this stage is that you can take that Ride Armor all the way through the level and even fight the boss with it. It requires some good back and forth with the machine and either a special item or one of Zero's weapons to get past one specific part though. I don't remember if X or Axl also have something to help with that. Either way, it's my favorite stage in the game as a result because they really thought this one through.

Super Llama · Post by **Super Llama** » 5 years ago

Heavy Sigh wrote: ↑5 years ago You can jump cancel the armor activation animation.

MAVERICK FACTS! FALLEN GIANT OF THE FOREST

Bamboo Pandamonium, known as Bamboo Pandemonium (バンブー・パンデモニウム Banbū Pandemoniumu, a one letter difference) in Japan, is a calm New Generation Reploid based on a giant panda.

Pandamonium was in charge of the rocket center in Booster Forest, a space research facility in China used before the Jakob Orbital Elevator was built. After it was deemed obsolete and abandoned, Pandamonium stayed at the facility. When he became a Maverick, he collected data on the rockets in the facility for Sigma. He believes the world wants to be destroyed, as its history has been spent making destructive things like missiles and Reploids, and likes Sigma's plan to create a new world.

ALTERNATE DIALOGUE!
Before defeating Four Mavericks

X

Bamboo Pandamonium: Did you know that the earliest form of rocketry was missiles used for war?

X: .........

Bamboo Pandamonium: All of history has been spent making things whose sole purpose is to destroy. Missiles... Reploids...

X: You talk like a Maverick. No Reploid wishes for destruction.

Bamboo Pandamonium: What wishes for destruction... is this world. We're just helping it along and giving it what it wants...

ZERO

Bamboo Pandamonium: You mean to tell me you've never thought such things yourself, Zero? That the world wishes for destruction and nothing more?

Zero: .........

Bamboo Pandamonium: That's why space rockets were invented. To escape this destructive world.

Zero: Gimme a break. This perfect world you Mavericks keep blabbering about doesn't even exist.

Bamboo Pandamonium: No, it doesn't. That's why we must destroy this one.

AXL

Bamboo Pandamonium: You have the same copy ability that we new generation Reploids enjoy.

Axl: ..........

Bamboo Pandamonium: Have you ever thought that power could change the world?

Axl: The only thing I think is how it comes in handy in whipping you Mavericks!

Bamboo Pandamonium: Such petulance. I suppose we have no use for you after all.

After defeating Four Mavericks

ZERO

Bamboo Pandamonium: You mean to tell me you've never thought such things yourself, Zero? That the world wishes for destruction and nothing more?

Zero: Is that what Sigma tells you?

Bamboo Pandamonium: Perhaps. Perhaps my master has also seen a little of himself inside of you...

Zero: Whatever. It's finished between me and Sigma.

Bamboo Pandamonium: What will end, Zero, is this world.

AXL

Bamboo Pandamonium: You have the same copy ability that we new generation Reploids enjoy. Why do you think my master overlooked you when he assembled the others?

Axl: Your joy at being chosen by that worm proves just how Maverick you've become!

Bamboo Pandamonium: It's because you are not needed in our new world.

You can also air dash with the ride armor given to you at the start, and the special weapon button shoots a stun projectile from the shoulder-mounted cannon which is great for those gauntlet rooms.

Also, if you aim your shots just right you can destroy the pilots of the other ride armors without destroying the armor and jack them for yourself but they lack all the blue ride armor's neat abilities.

Also, according to a Google search, the earliest rockets were Chinese fire arrows. Bamboo Pandamonium's story checks out.

Leet · Post by **Leet** » 5 years ago

Super Llama wrote:Also, according to a Google search, the earliest rockets were Chinese fire arrows. Bamboo Pandamonium's story checks out.

"And if all others accepted the lie which the Maverick Hunters imposed - if all records told the same tale - then the lie passed into history and became truth."

Paragraph · Post by **Paragraph** » 5 years ago

This stage's puzzle is the fucking worst and I hate it as a result now. Carrying the ride armour through the entire level is a ludicrous pain in the ass and I don't envy raocow having to do it on camera. I finally managed to do it yesterday, but it was never fun. One thing that kept me a little sane: the Ride Armor is the ONE thing in pretty much every X game that lets you air-dash after a dash-jump. This combined with your ability to cancel its clunky landing animation allows you to FLY through the first part of the stage, which you'll have to do often to get more attempts at the rare metal.

I'll do a write-up of things to collect later. As before, I'll post it in the thread spoilered if people wanna be surprised by raocow's cleanup video, and so that interested parties (Chirei?) who also know the game well can point out errors/add their own tips.

Chirei · Post by **Chirei** » 5 years ago

Paragraph wrote: ↑5 years ago I'll do a write-up of things to collect later. As before, I'll post it in the thread spoilered if people wanna be surprised by raocow's cleanup video, and so that interested parties (Chirei?) who also know the game well can point out errors/add their own tips.

I would say put a spoiler within the spoiler for the Crystal Wall metals. These can -almost- be intuited, but they are so seemingly arbitrary that you might as well be blatant with where they are.

As for the others, it has been a while since I have gotten all the rare metals, but I will see what I can do when the list goes up. Might want to section them off by stage since the game does have an indicator as well.

Paragraph · Post by **Paragraph** » 5 years ago

Alright, buckle up folks (and especially raocow), this is gonna be a thing. Everything spoilered for your reading pleasure. And yeah, I thought of also spoilering the more direct hints! I'll suggest people to bring as well, because nothing worse than going through e.g. Central White all the way and realizing you need both Zero and X but you brought Axl.

I'll be using stage names instead of boss names here, hope that's okay.

BUT WAIT, THERE IS MORE!

X8 has even more hidden unlockables, most of them New Game+ related. You know what? I'll get to those a day or so before your final video, then you can decide if you want to show some of them off or not :).

Chirei · Post by **Chirei** » 5 years ago

Some extra notes and tips for doing the MEGA-MAXIMUM Cleanup:

Central White: Rare Metal

You can actually get this with NO abilities, but you will need X and Zero not knocked out at the end, and good timing.

Do your best Double Jump from the right side, and then right as you start descending from the second jump, start switching player characters as rapidly as you can while still holding left. Switching will cancel your downward momentum, and if you do this just right, you will be able to grab onto the left ledge without any other items or weapons used.

Booster Forest: Ride Armor Tricks

The Ride Armor can actually use that gun on its shoulder to fire a stunning plasma orb. It will help you keep it alive in the robot vs robot rooms.

In the second part of the level, you can actually regain the blue Ride Armor. Zero makes it very easy, but I think you can do it naked with anyone. Just take the lowest path and on the conveyor where the crates are falling down, use them to jump back up to where the upper ledge conveyor is, and go to the left. There will be a blue Ride Armor there that respawns, and you can go back and get it as many times as you want long as you are in the second part of Booster Forest. However, once you pass the second robot gauntlet and enter the third area, you're out of luck.

The Ride Armor can actually go on crates without crushing them. Dash boost up next to a crate and jump against it, and you will see that on the earliest possible frame, the Ride Armor will kind of clamp onto the crate's edge. Use this to get up stairs of crates without destroying them. You are actually intended to do this if you're really skilled, which allows you to take the Ride Armor all the way up to Bamboo Pandamonium himself, making him the second boss you can fight with a Ride Armor after Magma Dragoon.

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Other than these, all I can say is that it's a bit "eeeh" that you still have to buy these unlockables. I would be fine if you JUST wanted to get all of X's capsule parts honestly, since they are free and far more interesting than most of the Rare Metals. This is Megaman X8, after all.

Grounder · Post by **Grounder** » 5 years ago

Heavy Sigh · Post by **Heavy Sigh** » 5 years ago

raocow you deffo wanna do this level again and ace all the fights. There's a special surprise if you do!

MAVERICK FACTS! Assassin from the Depths of Outer Space

Optic Sunflower, known as Optic Sunfloward (オプティック・サンフラワード Oputikku Sanfurawādo) in Japan, is a New Generation Reploid based on a sunflower.

Sunflower was originally responsible for running Troia Base, a virtual Hunter training facility stationed in Europe. When he became a Maverick, he caused the management program of the training area, "Helios", to go haywire, endangering many newbie Hunters. Tampering with the training program also damaged Sunflower's mental circuits, causing him to forget things at inopportune times.

ALTERNATE DIALOGUE

Trivia
When Sunflower uses his Overdrive, an image of the Final Weapon (from Mega Man X4) is seen. Given the nature of Troia Base, this is most likely a recreation (holographic or otherwise); however, it is the source of the attack.
Strangely, despite having a design based off a plant, Optic Sunflower is weak to wood/leaf-elemental weapons/techniques. This is likely possible because he is a light and space-themed Maverick, as several cosmic Robot Masters and Mavericks have been weak to such elemental weapons.

Chirei · Post by **Chirei** » 5 years ago

Extra Cleanup tip: You may want to buy Prickle Barriers from the shop. You can only hold one, but they're very cheap, and will prevent you from dying from spikes a single time (You will go down to 1 HP, unless you already have 1 HP) which will make it much easier to traverse a lot of sections without having to restart or get downgraded or lose your Ride Armor or whatever.

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Items Obtained

Arm Parts Hermes

This powerful Arm Upgrade changes X's last level charge shot into a Spread Charge Shot. It does not affect any other qualities of his buster, but each of the three shots from the Spread Charge Shot keep the capability to break through shields. Fire them point-blank at a boss for some mean damage.

And, of course, as with all Arm Upgrades since the beginning, it will allow X to charge all the Special Weapons.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Shining Ray

Uncharged: X lets off a firework in the air.

Charged: X shoots a bigger firework that explodes more times.

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Tenshouha

A massive pillar of light collapses where Zero punches the ground. His Giga Attack for this game!

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Ray Gun

It's the Ray Gun from X7! This time, it has auto-fire, so it's even better!

Paragraph · Post by **Paragraph** » 5 years ago

Everyone always sucks horribly at these trials the first time, don't sweat it. They're not THAT bad...if you use Zero as I recommended. The first is one of the worst if only because it takes so ungodly long no matter what you want, and it's super easy to screw up the rhythm very early, leaving you always hoping that you miiiight recover, but no, you have to be basically perfect for the entire (overlong) duration of this shit.

The trick is to kill all of the bots as EARLY as possible, and I don't see how to realistically do that without super well timed and place charge shot (even that is super iffy for the dudes flying in from both sides)...or Zero, as said. Again, hold the special weapon button in the air. Let go, fall to the ground and have it ready for the next one between waves.

Oh, and they always spawn the same way, so you could also memorize them if you keep having trouble. In fact, that might be required - I did it out of muscle memory more than anything as I was learning the stage. Like one left, one right, from both sides, two left, two right or something like that. This allows you to stand with Zero on the correct side already and be in the air, spinning, as they spawn into your waiting blades. You need 90 or more for an S-rank, and I think it's almost impossible to get more than 95. So yeah, it's tight.

The other huge problem is the gear room with the two (on high rank!) dudes popping up left and right. I have no idea how you do this without Zero and his long range weapon. If you have that, use the same spinning technique to hit both at once and hopefully kill them before they vanish at the bottom or, God forbid, you have to change position.

Otherwise, the challenges aren't that bad. Again, Zero just has the speed and DPS required to get you through quickly and efficiently.

Apart from the trials being stupid and making you feel like shit the first few times through, I don't think this stage is too bad, actually. The inter-trial parts ramp up interestingly and have some pretty cool platforming, and there's some nice fights in there as well (like against the "dragon" miniboss). And it looks amazing.

Finally, for the cleanup, I didn't know yesterday if you'd get the buster part here or not; obviously you did, so disregard my paragraph about the choice at the start. Start with Primrose therefore to get the Head Parts I, then you can begin cleanup with Noah's Park and continue with your original order.

I'm also gonna have to add to Chirei's advice again: do not immediately buy a Prickle Barrier. You really, really want the long range weapon for Zero and you also absolutely have to buy the heavy weapon from Inferno for him, so that's a pretty huge mandatory money sink there already. If you have money left over for a Prickle Barrier afterwards, nice; but if you buy one right away, then immediately waste it trying to get the capsule in Primrose, you'll kick yourself.

LunarRainbowShyGuy · Post by **LunarRainbowShyGuy** » 5 years ago

I missed commenting yesterday, though I didn't really have much to say other than that I liked the stage, and that Bamboo Pandamonium is a great name. As for this stage, I like it quite a bit. I generally enjoy going for high ranks in games in which you are ranked, and this stage is no exception. Since you have to do well in order to get everything from this stage, I figure I might as well give some advice to make things easier, though it's in the spoiler box in case you'd rather do it without help.

raocow's talkhaus

Mega Man - We're Here Forever!

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