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Level Contest Japan

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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Crow »

toad run is better than minimal/maximal and staccato time zone
i've honestly never played a video game in my life
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Ashan »

AlchemistHohenheim wrote: 6 years ago I feel like Bullet Heaven would've benefited from being like...half (or maybe 3/4) of the length it actually was, considering the difficulty of some of those jumps with the autoscrolling.
I also think it would have benefitted from an engine where you don't start off inching along then suddenly fly forward at the speed of light within a second. SMBX has terrible momentum imo

Not gonna mention which engine I think this level would have worked better in, but it's one where you have much better air control. :roll:
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Emral »

Ashan wrote: 6 years ago
AlchemistHohenheim wrote: 6 years ago I feel like Bullet Heaven would've benefited from being like...half (or maybe 3/4) of the length it actually was, considering the difficulty of some of those jumps with the autoscrolling.
I also think it would have benefitted from an engine where you don't start off inching along then suddenly fly forward at the speed of light within a second. SMBX has terrible momentum imo

Not gonna mention which engine I think this level would have worked better in, but it's one where you have much better air control. :roll:
Momentum isn't really the issue here. The issue is the fact that the bullets continue flying when you take damage. Someone wrote code to freeze those, too, but that piece of code has never been used in a released level afaik.
I'd argue Bullet Heaven would feel pretty unforgiving in the other engine due to the smaller screen size giving the player less time to react and less room to jump between the bullets. Accounting for that by using slower autoscroll or even slower bullet bills will only dumb down how much can be done with the idea. I feel Bullet Heaven is a bit repetitive, but it was done well within the limits of the engine, with only the one hookjump sticking out due to SMBX's stupid semi-freeze rules.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Ashan »

Enjl wrote: 6 years ago
Ashan wrote: 6 years ago
AlchemistHohenheim wrote: 6 years ago I feel like Bullet Heaven would've benefited from being like...half (or maybe 3/4) of the length it actually was, considering the difficulty of some of those jumps with the autoscrolling.
I also think it would have benefitted from an engine where you don't start off inching along then suddenly fly forward at the speed of light within a second. SMBX has terrible momentum imo

Not gonna mention which engine I think this level would have worked better in, but it's one where you have much better air control. :roll:
Momentum isn't really the issue here. The issue is the fact that the bullets continue flying when you take damage. Someone wrote code to freeze those, too, but that piece of code has never been used in a released level afaik.
I'd argue Bullet Heaven would feel pretty unforgiving in the other engine due to the smaller screen size giving the player less time to react and less room to jump between the bullets. Accounting for that by using slower autoscroll or even slower bullet bills will only dumb down how much can be done with the idea. I feel Bullet Heaven is a bit repetitive, but it was done well within the limits of the engine, with only the one hookjump sticking out due to SMBX's stupid semi-freeze rules.
I really think that one jump raocow was having trouble with in particular (where there's 3 sets of 2 bullets coming in a 90-degree rotated V-shape you have to hop up to get to a platform above) would have been completely alleviated with better momentum. He wasn't able to turn around and get his leftward momentum fast enough because the acceleration is so wonky.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Emral »

Ashan wrote: 6 years ago
Enjl wrote: 6 years ago
Ashan wrote: 6 years ago
I also think it would have benefitted from an engine where you don't start off inching along then suddenly fly forward at the speed of light within a second. SMBX has terrible momentum imo

Not gonna mention which engine I think this level would have worked better in, but it's one where you have much better air control. :roll:
Momentum isn't really the issue here. The issue is the fact that the bullets continue flying when you take damage. Someone wrote code to freeze those, too, but that piece of code has never been used in a released level afaik.
I'd argue Bullet Heaven would feel pretty unforgiving in the other engine due to the smaller screen size giving the player less time to react and less room to jump between the bullets. Accounting for that by using slower autoscroll or even slower bullet bills will only dumb down how much can be done with the idea. I feel Bullet Heaven is a bit repetitive, but it was done well within the limits of the engine, with only the one hookjump sticking out due to SMBX's stupid semi-freeze rules.
I really think that one jump raocow was having trouble with in particular (where there's 3 sets of 2 bullets coming in a 90-degree rotated V-shape you have to hop up to get to a platform above) would have been completely alleviated with better momentum. He wasn't able to turn around and get his leftward momentum fast enough because the acceleration is so wonky.
You're repeating what you said before. No comment on the other points I've made?
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Lockirby2 »

Ashan wrote: 6 years ago I really think that one jump raocow was having trouble with in particular (where there's 3 sets of 2 bullets coming in a 90-degree rotated V-shape you have to hop up to get to a platform above) would have been completely alleviated with better momentum. He wasn't able to turn around and get his leftward momentum fast enough because the acceleration is so wonky.
It would certainly have made that jump easier. But IMO, it would have been less interesting, and not more fair (as in, I don't think there's anything unfair about that jump right now).
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Darkonius64 »

Bullet Bonanza eyyy
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Mata Hari »

turns out mouser was baphomet all along

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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by FrozenQuills »

"this seriously feels like a worldpeace level"
this has exceeded all of my expectations, thanks for play
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by S.N.N. »

FrozenQuills is one of my favorite level designers at this point. Ever since I played his VLDC9 level last year, it was pretty clear he had a good sense of how to create a well-rounded and unique experience. Today's level in particular was such a simple concept (technically), but it was executed in a way that only a skilled designer could pull off. Well done - probably my favorite level in the contest.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Lockirby2 »

The boss in Bullet Bonanza was a lot better once I realized that standing far away from the giant tank is safer than standing right next to it. :oops:

When I was playing FrozenQuill's level, I got the exact same WorldPeace vibes from it. I would have mentioned it here even if raocow didn't.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Crow »

really liked the second level today. the gimmick was simple but there's a lot of mileage in it, and the level design itself was pretty tight. and i mean first level was solid too.
i've honestly never played a video game in my life
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by SAJewers »

Level would've been great if it didn't use text to tell the player what to do, but that's just me.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Mea »

that last screen of the level with the yoshi dismounting shell hops really looked like it flowed, that part looked really fluid and neat
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by Lockirby2 »

This level is pretty awesomesauce. It does a great job of introducing the different types of jumps you have to pull off. If that last room was thrown at the player right away, it would seem janky and unforgiving. But after the rest of the level, everything feels natural, and it's a great climax to the level. The puzzles were also quite on point.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by FrozenQuills »

This basically felt like a SMW kaizo-lite level when I played it. Really creative and fun while being pretty challenging.
The shell/yoshi setups were amazing too.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by Crow »

this is the kind of level i love, unique and clever with a ton of interesting platforming & generous checkpointing so it never gets tedious
so yeah, wow
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by ztarwuff »

Oh man! 7NameSam's Yoshi level is so interesting. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think it used much LunaLua at all, if any.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by Zha Hong Lang »

ztarwuff wrote: 6 years ago Oh man! 7NameSam's Yoshi level is so interesting. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think it used much LunaLua at all, if any.
The level most certainly used SMBX2 elements, though I'm uncertain how much lua was written for the level itself.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by Emral »

Zha Hong Lang wrote: 6 years ago
ztarwuff wrote: 6 years ago Oh man! 7NameSam's Yoshi level is so interesting. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think it used much LunaLua at all, if any.
The level most certainly used SMBX2 elements, though I'm uncertain how much lua was written for the level itself.
like 80 lines.
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-maybe another thing i missed
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by Rixithechao »

To me one of the coolest parts of this level is that, while it does use Lua, it's not in your face about it. The code is mainly used to add subtle visual touches (I honestly didn't even register the paralx stuff until Enjl pointed it out here!) and to support and accentuate the central mechanics with tweaks like those faster fireballs.

Like with some of the levels earlier in this LP, Yoshis at the Crag, Perilous Peak and Bullet Bonanza were ones I experienced in some way or another back when the contest was still fresh. All great levels, strong note to end the SMBX2 selection on. Would've been great levels to end the LP on in general but there is still the other batch, and while I'm very much in favor of the engine rao's been playing up to this point there are some neat things SMBX 38A can do that SMBX2 can't yet.

I don't recall seeing any levels that fully took advantage of those features, but I wasn't around to see a lot of the 38A entries being judged and there are some neat ones I did see that I mistakenly thought were made in SMBX2 at the time, sooooooo... yeah. I may not be able to watch until the end of the week, but I'm looking forward to seeing where we go from here!
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by SAJewers »

Rockythechao wrote: 6 years ago To me one of the coolest parts of this level is that, while it does use Lua, it's not in your face about it. The code is mainly used to add subtle visual touches (I honestly didn't even register the paralx stuff until Enjl pointed it out here!) and to support and accentuate the central mechanics with tweaks like those faster fireballs.
IMO that's the way it should be.That or go full lua to where it's not even remotely a platformer anymore.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by Rixithechao »

SAJewers wrote:
Rockythechao wrote: 6 years ago To me one of the coolest parts of this level is that, while it does use Lua, it's not in your face about it. The code is mainly used to add subtle visual touches (I honestly didn't even register the paralx stuff until Enjl pointed it out here!) and to support and accentuate the central mechanics with tweaks like those faster fireballs.
IMO that's the way it should be.That or go full lua to where it's not even remotely a platformer anymore.
I mean, I was just saying it's cool that the level uses Lua sparingly and very deliberately, not that that kind of approach should be applied to all levels/projects or that it's somehow more valid than other ways of doing things. YatC is very much substance over style, but it's not like those two things have to be mutually exclusive. People can use code to different degrees and still make rad stuff.

Really, I'd argue the only wrong way to use Lua -- or teascript, or ASM or any other scripting language for any engine -- is when the end result actively detracts from the player's experience and/or enjoyment -- adding limits or gimmicks that work against the mechanics/level design, distracting effects, stuff like that.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming currency

Post by Alice »

SAJewers wrote: 6 years agoLevel would've been great if it didn't use text to tell the player what to do, but that's just me.
I'd have to disagree. While the text isn't necessary it's really helpful to be introduced to the mechanics that way sometimes. The ones regarding throwing in particular are really helpful once you figure out what they mean because they can help you mentally coordinate your actions.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - platforming horses

Post by SAJewers »

Rockythechao wrote: 6 years ago
SAJewers wrote:
Rockythechao wrote: 6 years ago To me one of the coolest parts of this level is that, while it does use Lua, it's not in your face about it. The code is mainly used to add subtle visual touches (I honestly didn't even register the paralx stuff until Enjl pointed it out here!) and to support and accentuate the central mechanics with tweaks like those faster fireballs.
IMO that's the way it should be.That or go full lua to where it's not even remotely a platformer anymore.
I mean, I was just saying it's cool that the level uses Lua sparingly and very deliberately, not that that kind of approach should be applied to all levels/projects or that it's somehow more valid than other ways of doing things. YatC is very much substance over style, but it's not like those two things have to be mutually exclusive. People can use code to different degrees and still make rad stuff.

Really, I'd argue the only wrong way to use Lua -- or teascript, or ASM or any other scripting language for any engine -- is when the end result actively detracts from the player's experience and/or enjoyment -- adding limits or gimmicks that work against the mechanics/level design, distracting effects, stuff like that.
See, to me, most of the levels in this contest that used lua, the lua actively detracted from the lest of the level for me, with this one being the most notable exception.
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