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Level Contest Japan

this is the place where lps are being talked about. it's important to talk about games being played on the internet.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Leet »

I don't really get when people portray touhou in fan stuff as some sort of wistful moe deal. Touhou's about rude ladies beating up randos and taking names.
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by alleightbits »

All right, so you withhold level placements to avoid controversy, but you keep favorite placements in.
Strap yourselves in, guys.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Lockirby2 »

I don't think the first level was bad, and I know little about Touhou (I don't play much Pokemon either). It was a decent, but easy (and a bit too short), level. One thing I liked was how it tutorialized the downwind by placing a Goomba in a valley, so you'd land on it even if you didn't notice the wind changing. I wish it did more clever things like that instead of infodumping a bunch of stuff in the opening text box. Spinjumping on the rotating guys was also pretty neat. The background in each half of the level provided a nice atmosphere.

The hill level was just there, and felt unpolished to boot. Following the coin guides in the bonus will get you killed, as raocow demonstrated. Not to mention that it also puts you in significant danger (compared to the rest of the level) for... coins? Not really worth it. Following your instincts and taking the top route will also take you to that dead end where you just backtrack later, forcing you to backtrack several times in that section. It's not a hot mess, but it's not as much fun as most of the levels thus far.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by snoruntpyro »

8bitgamer123 wrote: 6 years ago All right, so you withhold level placements to avoid controversy, but you keep favorite placements in.
Strap yourselves in, guys.
horikawa made me >:C
(most of the ones i can remember off the top of my head were well deserved though)
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Re: Level Contest Japan - surprise-a!

Post by Alice »

Zinfandel wrote: 6 years agoA bit late, but it's the "Chapter 1 Menus" theme from Super Meat Boy - the theme when you're at the Forest stage select.
Ah, so it was technically a remix but one from the game itself. I forgot that the chapter views had different music than their levels. Thanks!
8bitgamer123 wrote: 6 years agoAll right, so you withhold level placements to avoid controversy, but you keep favorite placements in.
Strap yourselves in, guys.
Well it really shouldn't be more controversial to say "X level was my favorite" than "X level was the best in the game" so I don't see the issue. It's very easy for something to appeal strongly to someone without blinding them to its flaws.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by cozyduck »

I just wanna go on record saying that I really enjoy seeing the level rankings during contest, despite often disagreeing with them, and I feel like something is missing now.

Also, I think fear of potential controversy is a REALLY bad reason to omit the scores. I find it a bit cowardly to be honest, and it deprives the thread of interesting discussion. There's nothing wrong with criticizing a judges or even another talkhausers view as long as it doesn't turn to ad hominems, and there is moderation here for when such cases happen.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Ivy »

I like going through the contest without scores. But it would be nice to maybe receive a text file with them at the end of the LP
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by King of GETs »

First off, to get the numerical formalities out of the way:

- Today was raocow's 5th video
- The video was uploaded on the 25th
- At the end of the level, raocow had 5 stars and died 55 times

I find it to be pretty funny how people are automatically assuming this is a Touhou level when it's actually a Pokémon level -- more specifically, an Ultra Beast level. Each of the Ultra Beasts are represented somewhere in the level itself:

- Nihilego is the Goomba (look at the color scheme and pattern)
- Buzzwole is the color scheme of the checkpoint
- Pheromosa is the mushroom (look at the specific sizes of the three gills)
- Xurkitree's head is the spike ball
- Celesteela's arms are the upper scrolling section (also represented by the bamboo background)
- Kartana are the orange objects rotating around that the player must spin jump on
- Guzzlord is represented by the symbol above the first visible checkpoint

There's also a small irrelevant symbol during the line of Goombas at the end, but it blends in with the hill, so if you saw it, good for you.

So for people claiming this is a "Touhou" level, it's less of a Touhou level and more of a Pokémon level with a couple Touhou themes.

As for how this level came to be, this was my first time working with lua. I pretty much just experimented with what I thought looked good. The cutscene at the beginning was my way of finding out just how easy it was to load custom graphics. The possibilities really are endless with that. I chose to do transitioning particle effects since I had never seen them done before. The same thing is true for using the BooBuddies lua in part of the level. Boo Circles have been used pretty frequently in SMW hacks as obstacles to go around, but I never saw them used as a way for a player to get across a gap, so I experimented with it. The level was actually a bit shorter than its final version, but I added that extra section with the coins as a challenge section.

The boss took multiple days of making and play testing to get working properly. A lot of it is controlled by events, but stuff like player movement and graphic/sound replacements were all done with lua. If you're playing the game at 100% speed, the movements of the boss match up with the music being played in the background.

The ending was my way of finding out that you can activate events using lua. This came very late in the development of the level, so I didn't get to fully experiment with it, but the ideas of what you can do with it are amazing.

Overall, the level was really fun to make, but I feel like it's just a small sample of what lua is a capable of. There are so many ways to build on these concepts to make them even more intricate, and I look forward to experimenting with these and newer concepts in the future.
Last edited by King of GETs 6 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by raocow »

cozyduck wrote: 6 years ago I find it a bit cowardly to be honest, and it deprives the thread of interesting discussion.
you may call it interesting discussion, but in my experience it's more grueling circular arguments that don't go anywhere
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Mandew »

I *think* we can discuss each level's merits or demerits without having a score to lean on or be spiteful about.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Leet »

i'll rate them all myself: 100/100, great job everyone
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Lockirby2 »

Don't care one way or the other about the scores. It doesn't bother me if a level was ranked way off what I think it deserves.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by SAJewers »

I've always been an advocate not showing scores or rankings or anything, just make it be less a contest, and more a community coming together and making levels for fun, getting critique on how you make levels, and being able to see how good people think you are as a level designer, and using that to grow as a level designer.

Not showing scores is good imo.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by The0x539 »

King of GETs wrote: 6 years agoAs for how this level came to be, this was my first time working with lua. I pretty much just experimented with what I thought looked good. The cutscene at the beginning was my way of finding out just how easy it was to load custom graphics. The possibilities really are endless with that. I chose to do transitioning particle effects since I had never seen them done before. The same thing is true for using the BooBuddies lua in part of the level. Boo Circles have been used pretty frequently in SMW hacks as obstacles to go around, but I never saw them used as a way for a player to get across a gap, so I experimented with it. The level was actually a bit shorter than its final version, but I added that extra section with the coins as a challenge section.

The boss took multiple days of making and play testing to get working properly. A lot of it is controlled by events, but stuff like player movement and graphic/sound replacements were all done with lua. If you're playing the game at 100% speed, the movements of the boss match up with the music being played in the background.

The ending was my way of finding out that you can activate events using lua. This came very late in the development of the level, so I didn't get to fully experiment with it, but the ideas of what you can do with it are amazing.

Overall, the level was really fun to make, but I feel like it's just a small sample of what lua is a capable of. There are so many ways to build on these concepts to make them even more intricate, and I look forward to experimenting with these and newer concepts in the future.
For the sake of the sanity of those who look at your code, please, figure out how to make your Lua less repetitive :P
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by King of GETs »

The0x539 wrote: 6 years ago
King of GETs wrote: 6 years agoetc.
For the sake of the sanity of those who look at your code, please, figure out how to make your Lua less repetitive :P
As I stated, this was my first time working with lua. A huge issue was that I have no idea how to loop things or set things to a finite pattern when a variable is between values. I think it had something to do with that "for k, v" thing, but I didn't understand it at all, so I just did everything manually.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Alice »

King of GETs wrote: 6 years agoAs I stated, this was my first time working with lua. A huge issue was that I have no idea how to loop things or set things to a finite pattern when a variable is between values. I think it had something to do with that "for k, v" thing, but I didn't understand it at all, so I just did everything manually.
Have you tried looking at stuff like this? Most notable this bit is fairly straight forward:

Code: Select all

for i=10,1,-1 do
    print(i)
end
i=10 initializes a variable to 10. 1 is the value that the first variable needs to reach in order to end. -1 is the value to add to/subtract from i for each subsequent loop.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by King of GETs »

Alice wrote: 6 years ago
King of GETs wrote: 6 years agoAs I stated, this was my first time working with lua. A huge issue was that I have no idea how to loop things or set things to a finite pattern when a variable is between values. I think it had something to do with that "for k, v" thing, but I didn't understand it at all, so I just did everything manually.
Have you tried looking at stuff like this? Most notable this bit is fairly straight forward:

Code: Select all

for i=10,1,-1 do
    print(i)
end
i=10 initializes a variable to 10. 1 is the value that the first variable needs to reach in order to end. -1 is the value to add to/subtract from i for each subsequent loop.
Let's say I have a variable called "boss". At the start of the boss sequence, it adds 1 value for each frame. Then, once the boss reaches a certain section, it needs to do something.

Between variable values 2000 and 2800, I need to make the player character's player:mem loop between values 2 and 7, but this loop can only activate once every 5 variable values (2000, 2005, 2010, etc.) up to 2700.

This is an example of the code I was using:

Code: Select all

if boss == 2000 then
	player:mem(0x112, FIELD_WORD, 2);
end
if boss == 2005 then
	player:mem(0x112, FIELD_WORD, 3);
end
etc.
I repeated the code until the loop was done, and I set the player:mem value back to 1 at the end.

How would you accomplish this in a simple for k, v code?
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Darkonius64 »

I am late to the party lol, this contest will be a ride alright, i saw raocow's latest video and i did not expect sudden Nebby shenanigains.
Also you guys omitted the scores? GOOD.
I really liked the flame spooky bridge level thingy, even if the boss seemed a bit awkward to deal with.
I am obviously excited to see my level, but if i recall right it's at the end of one of the "zones" so it'll take a while.

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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by cozyduck »

raocow wrote: 6 years ago
cozyduck wrote: 6 years ago I find it a bit cowardly to be honest, and it deprives the thread of interesting discussion.
you may call it interesting discussion, but in my experience it's more grueling circular arguments that don't go anywhere
Fair enough, you got me there. I wonder if something could be done to actually produce better discussion though.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by Mikkofier »

cozyduck wrote: 6 years ago I wonder if something could be done to actually produce better discussion though.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this is mario?

Post by SAJewers »

Not a huge fan of the item babysitting in today's level.
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this is mario?

Post by Grounder »

filler content the level
Why don't you eat me?

I am perfectly tasty...

AND I'LL STEAL YOUR SOUL! :twisted:

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Re: Level Contest Japan - this isn't mario?

Post by The0x539 »

King of GETs wrote: 6 years ago
King of GETs wrote: 6 years agoAs I stated, this was my first time working with lua. A huge issue was that I have no idea how to loop things or set things to a finite pattern when a variable is between values. I think it had something to do with that "for k, v" thing, but I didn't understand it at all, so I just did everything manually.
Have you tried looking at stuff like this? Most notable this bit is fairly straight forward:

Code: Select all

for i=10,1,-1 do
    print(i)
end
i=10 initializes a variable to 10. 1 is the value that the first variable needs to reach in order to end. -1 is the value to add to/subtract from i for each subsequent loop.
Let's say I have a variable called "boss". At the start of the boss sequence, it adds 1 value for each frame. Then, once the boss reaches a certain section, it needs to do something.

Between variable values 2000 and 2800, I need to make the player character's player:mem loop between values 2 and 7, but this loop can only activate once every 5 variable values (2000, 2005, 2010, etc.) up to 2700.

This is an example of the code I was using:

Code: Select all

if boss == 2000 then
	player:mem(0x112, FIELD_WORD, 2);
end
if boss == 2005 then
	player:mem(0x112, FIELD_WORD, 3);
end
etc.
I repeated the code until the loop was done, and I set the player:mem value back to 1 at the end.

How would you accomplish this in a simple for k, v code?
Generic For is the wrong way to go about this. Modulo, however, is extremely useful.

Code: Select all

if boss >= 2000 and boss <= 2700 then
	if boss % 5 == 0 then
		player.powerup = player.powerup + 1
		if player.powerup > 7 then
			player.powerup = 2
		end
	end
end
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Re: Level Contest Japan - this is mario?

Post by SAJewers »

Grounder wrote: 6 years ago filler content the level
yeah, that's a better way to put it.
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