raocow's talkhaus

I can honestly say I had no issue with that jump. In fact, in the 3-4 times I played it, I never had the upper snake "lag" behind the lower snake.

Congrats on uncovering something that didn't happen to any of the three judges!!

!

I have no idea why that first level ranked lower than the second. First level had one really bad jump around 3:45, the other one was was full of bad snake and easily getting yourself locked into unwinnable states.

Today we learn that making a level that resembles something worldpeace did will boost your score!

Seriously, that's the only explanation as to why that second level ranked that high. 16th place with trial and error gameplay?

16th Place™

It didn't really look lime anything I'd enjoy, either.

S.N.N. wrote:I can honestly say I had no issue with that jump. In fact, in the 3-4 times I played it, I never had the upper snake "lag" behind the lower snake.

Congrats on uncovering something that didn't happen to any of the three judges!!

!

Well, morceau did mention earlier that the patches applied in the final product ruined some sprite placement and other setups, so that's probably the case here??

None of the patches would have had any effect on the block snake. Actually, the only things that would be affected by the applied patches are anything to do with line guides (which we've already seen on a couple occasions with platforms vanishing).

This might just be a case of all three of us missing it, coupled with a different experience than raocow (i.e. it only took me a couple of tries to beat it, and I thought it was really fun, so...).

I know fastROM affects the eating blocks in strange ways, so it's possible (with sa-1 affecting some sprite behaviours as well) that the level in its original form is better ordered than in the compiled rom (I'm not going to check though). Look forward to some more eating block shenanigans and possible irritable cow syndrome tomorrow.

I'm going to play devil's advocate here and point out that the upper path "lagging" was probably due to raocow waiting too long on that little ledge, a position I'm going to assume is perfectly placed high enough that the first path spawns and starts moving but low enough the second doesn't. Which assuming that's correct, is something he probably should have noticed with his extensive SMW experience. Not that the ledge isn't stupidly placed to encourage that unintended behavior, but some of the frustration could have been averted.

Nathan the Talkmaus wrote:First level had one really bad jump around 3:45

That wasn't even a bad jump, it was just a victim of raocow's general refusal to run across gaps (it's only very rarely that he runs across 1-tile gaps either, and I'm not sure why, because most of the time attempting to jump them is actually more dangerous.)

But I agree that the first level seemed significantly underrated and the second significantly overrated. But I haven't played either. I'd certainly say the first level looks better to me than Sprite Spam Level.

morsel/morceau wrote:I know fastROM affects the eating blocks in strange ways, so it's possible (with sa-1 affecting some sprite behaviours as well) that the level in its original form is better ordered than in the compiled rom

I can't confirm this at the moment, but I think eXcavator's original entry used SA-1. Actually, I think a good number of the entries overall used SA-1.

Either way, I'm already noticing the flood of "the judges are shit" occurring on YouTube over this particular entry, so there's no point in trying to defend the reasoning. I'm sure MrDeePay will throw me under the bus as usual to not bring any fault to himself as well, but it is what it is.

S.N.N. wrote:I'm sure MrDeePay will throw me under the bus as usual to not bring any fault to himself as well, but it is what it is.

This is a great dynamic to have within a judging team I tell you hwat

dr_kraid wrote:

S.N.N. wrote:I'm sure MrDeePay will throw me under the bus as usual to not bring any fault to himself as well, but it is what it is.

This is a great dynamic to have within a judging team I tell you hwat

Truly the best of pals.

S.N.N. wrote: Either way, I'm already noticing the flood of "the judges are shit" occurring on YouTube over this particular entry, so there's no point in trying to defend the reasoning. I'm sure MrDeePay will throw me under the bus as usual to not bring any fault to himself as well, but it is what it is.

What do you expect, it's youtube comments. One arguably poorly placed entry and the judges are all garbage. I can't wait to hear about how the MaGLX2 judges are all terrible because they misplaced one level out of 270.

I liked Laputa more than Peachpuff Peaks or that snake block stage from today...

But it seems kinda weird that the lagging snake block never once showed up during either the initial testing or the judging, considering how often it seemed to happen to rao.

S.N.N. wrote:Either way, I'm already noticing the flood of "the judges are shit" occurring on YouTube over this particular entry, so there's no point in trying to defend the reasoning.

Well, it's the YouTube comment section, where everyone has slept with everyone's mother and who disagrees with you is automatically a moron. Just let them talk and ignore it.

First level deserved higher, second level deserved lower, yadda yadda...

But yeah I loved the tileset + palette in the first level and I actually liked the design a lot.
I can see how creative the second level is (despite more levels using snake block mechanics possibly because of a certain earthly peace) but it had poor execution and inconsistency in mechanics is pretty bad.

No reason to berate the judges over this cause stuff like this is bound to happen. The only time to berate is when the majority of judgments are considered out of place by many.

Taigiry wrote:Well, it's the YouTube comment section, where everyone has slept with everyone's mother and who disagrees with you is automatically a moron. Just let them talk and ignore it.

I think this is a bit more accurate:

Well, it's the YouTube comment section where everyone is automatically a moron.

I mean if you guys legit didn't run into that particular issue ever in judging then fair enough, but like, if that's the case all three of you are just the luckiest butts, it looks like. I don't see how one could avoid that literally every time.

Also judging discussion aside I like how last year like two levels used the eating block and suddenly this year there are what, like, 8 levels with it? Thus far? A whole buttload more than last year, at any rate. And I'd have to do a bit more analysis than I care to do at the moment to verify but haven't like all of them been fairly high-placing?

S.N.N. wrote:

morsel/morceau wrote:I know fastROM affects the eating blocks in strange ways, so it's possible (with sa-1 affecting some sprite behaviours as well) that the level in its original form is better ordered than in the compiled rom

I can't confirm this at the moment, but I think eXcavator's original entry used SA-1. Actually, I think a good number of the entries overall used SA-1.

Either way, I'm already noticing the flood of "the judges are shit" occurring on YouTube over this particular entry, so there's no point in trying to defend the reasoning. I'm sure MrDeePay will throw me under the bus as usual to not bring any fault to himself as well, but it is what it is.

If it makes you feel any better, I've always questioned your judgment :D

General shitpostery aside, I think this should be a part of judging in the future. Stuff like going too fast, lagging behind (if it's possible to survive, obviously), cloning objects. Things someone might do after multiple deaths or by accident.

Nothing severe like playing it 9 times. Obviously, a puzzle isn't BAD because you have to give it a second to actually get through. Lots of puzzles require you to stop and figure out the trick. Just to make sure sensitive stuff doesn't break/important stuff doesn't fail to spawn.

I dunno, maybe you guys do this and got super lucky all three times or as one poster said, adding it to the world map is what broke it. Who knows.

Zyglrox Odyssey wrote:Also judging discussion aside I like how last year like two levels used the eating block and suddenly this year there are what, like, 8 levels with it? Thus far? A whole buttload more than last year, at any rate.

I think that'll be okay as long as it doesn't get as overused as the "weirdly shaped lands with geometric cutouts" gimmick everyone was on a couple years ago.

dr_kraid wrote:

Nathan the Talkmaus wrote:First level had one really bad jump around 3:45

That wasn't even a bad jump, it was just a victim of raocow's general refusal to run across gaps (it's only very rarely that he runs across 1-tile gaps either, and I'm not sure why, because most of the time attempting to jump them is actually more dangerous.)

It tripped up the other LPer I watch a lot longer and caused numerous deaths. Still seems a pretty bad spot anyway, what with the thwimp making you more-than-likely forced to take a hit to keep running at the spot.

dr_kraid wrote:

S.N.N. wrote:I'm sure MrDeePay will throw me under the bus as usual to not bring any fault to himself as well, but it is what it is.

This is a great dynamic to have within a judging team I tell you hwat

When you choose DeePay to be a judge, you've already made that decision.

Ometeotl wrote:

dr_kraid wrote:

S.N.N. wrote:I'm sure MrDeePay will throw me under the bus as usual to not bring any fault to himself as well, but it is what it is.

This is a great dynamic to have within a judging team I tell you hwat

When you choose DeePay to be a judge, you've already made that decision.

Sounds like fun?

I know I wasn't trying to shit on the judges, just kinda giving my opinion. I know nothing's gonna be perfect in the end, it's being human.
Though I dunno if people are talking about what I said at all in this thread, could be me trying too hard to be nice right now :/

Also yeah the youtube comments certaintly are... ...youtube comments. I'm sure you judges enjoyed the level and the most objectivly explainable error that there could be is personal taste, which is uncontrollable. You're not in the wrong for these scores.

It has to be either something raocow is doing, or his emulator. I just tried that level 6 times (using the official VLDC version, with retroarch/bsnes-mercury-balanced) and not once did that top snake lag behind.