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A Second Mario Thing: free alex

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Slit08
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Slit08 » 5 years ago

Err what's up with today's A2MT Episode?
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby SyStemkraSh5642 » 5 years ago

"It felt like a continuation"

That's because they originally were one level now split into two.

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Willhart
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Willhart » 5 years ago

I thought they only had the same tileset. Gimmicks were different in each level and both of them felt like complete levels thanks to the lenght and dragoncoin placement.

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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Willhart wrote:I thought they only had the same tileset. Gimmicks were different in each level and both of them felt like complete levels thanks to the lenght and dragoncoin placement.
It would hardly be the first time in the history of custom level making that a too long level felt like two completely disconnected parts. Although, if this was split into two levels, why weren't more? I suppose there is the level limit in the ROM to consider.

This level looked pretty OK all the way through. It's at least a 5/10 I think. That's on an actual scale, not a video game journalism one. What's 5/10 on that scale anyway? Probably about a 7.5/10 or so, maybe an 8/10. Depends on how much money Sept would be prepared to give me.

Septentrion Pleiades
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 5 years ago

Doctor Shemp wrote:It would hardly be the first time in the history of custom level making that a too long level felt like two completely disconnected parts. Although, if this was split into two levels, why weren't more? I suppose there is the level limit in the ROM to consider.
The reason is that earlier levels had different management and that there were open slots when I did it. I've wondered this myself during the LP when I started realizing how long some of this levels are. Although the reviewers of my time where much more strict, they hardly knew how to make a good game.

The original version of this level actually had a bit of "Something to do with Layer 2" in it.
Doctor Shemp wrote:This level looked pretty OK all the way through. It's at least a 5/10 I think. That's on an actual scale, not a video game journalism one. What's 5/10 on that scale anyway? Probably about a 7.5/10 or so, maybe an 8/10. Depends on how much money Sept would be prepared to give me.
I'm not sure how to feel about this. You've never had as low standard as the A2MT crew did. Would you say this game averages 2/10 or something?
Last edited by Septentrion Pleiades on 31 Jul 2014, 01:06, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Well, it's hard to tell without playing it and just from looking at it, but here's my personal scale for reference:
0/10: Absolutely Disgusting
1/10: Terrible
2/10: Very Bad
3/10: Bad
4/10: Below Average
5/10: Average
6/10: Good
7/10: Very Good
8/10: Very Very Good
9/10: Excellent
10/10: Masterpiece

Shard1697
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Shard1697 » 5 years ago

This level might be the only situation where the jumping fish generator is kinda cool.

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raocow
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby raocow » 5 years ago

Slit08 wrote:Err what's up with today's A2MT Episode?
what do you mean ?
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Septentrion Pleiades
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Septentrion Pleiades » 5 years ago

I think I was the only person who tried using the deadweight bro... ...I thought he was an official enemy to use because he was already insert.

I don't recall the wizard appearing in other levels either. raocow was being creamed by the wizard despite him being common in hacks. What other levels have the wizard?
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby jayScribble » 5 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:I don't recall the wizard appearing in other levels either. raocow was being creamed by the wizard despite him being common in hacks. What other levels have the wizard?
I don't exactly remember, but the wizard was used at least once in an earlier A2MT video.
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Bwarch » 5 years ago

Maaan, I dig this here Pitfall level. Maybe I'm just taken in by the nifty visual shenanigans going on but it feels alright, it feels like a neat level.

And so a neat level it is.

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Willhart
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Willhart » 5 years ago

jayScribble wrote:
Septentrion Pleiades wrote:I don't recall the wizard appearing in other levels either. raocow was being creamed by the wizard despite him being common in hacks. What other levels have the wizard?
I don't exactly remember, but the wizard was used at least once in an earlier A2MT video.
I think there was one wizard somewhere on the beach quarter. It was given the name Jerry the giraffe magikoopa somewhere in the A2MT dev thread.

The level today was good looking especially in some parts. The coin collecting gimmick was a bit too tedious though, and most areas were on the long side.

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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby jayScribble » 5 years ago

A good designed level based on a classic but with some troubling designs, such as the coin collecting process being a tad too tedious, some surprise shell kicks, especially the one at the second half, and some big character discrimination at the second half (I was about to say big mario discrimination, but I just remember the collab raocow's playing).

I was hoping that a "Nintondo" related joke with the old "Activision" logo was made, but no dice.
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Ometeotl » 5 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:
Doctor Shemp wrote:This level looked pretty OK all the way through. It's at least a 5/10 I think. That's on an actual scale, not a video game journalism one. What's 5/10 on that scale anyway? Probably about a 7.5/10 or so, maybe an 8/10. Depends on how much money Sept would be prepared to give me.
I'm not sure how to feel about this. You've never had as low standard as the A2MT crew did. Would you say this game averages 2/10 or something?
Your ego is showing.

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sedron
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby sedron » 5 years ago

Atari throwback graphics made today's level stand out a lot, and overall it's a neat gimmick. That said, using archaic level design choices to complement archaic graphics does not help things even a little bit.

The biggest issue this level had was the constant stream of obstacles you don't get adequate time to react to. Oh hey, another level that uses kick koopas awfully. In particular, that last kicked shell in the second half that comes from above the screen only serves as a "screw you," to the player. If an obstacle is infuriating to be stopped by, but barely registers if you accidentally get past it, then you've failed to make a good or interesting challenge for the player.

The ambush birds are another huge problem. They come too fast, often in large groups (to ensure you get hit,) and they're most often thrown at the player mid-jump, when their options for dealing with the enemies (should they notice them quickly,) are close to none, if any. Being generated later on is also bad, but for obviously different reasons. If the birds were placed such that the player has adequate time to react in addition to actual options for reacting, they'd be much less problematic. Being combined with the aforementioned kicking koopas really only serves to compound the issue.

The falling platforms aren't as offensive as the birds and snakes, but again, they compound the issues. I'm not a fan of falling platforms disguised as regular ones in general, really.

The level definitely has faults that don't relate to ambush, too. The level length would probably be a bit more forgivable had the level actually stuck to a certain set of obstacles, but it doesn't. It has a uniting aesthetic theme, but no such thing exists from a gameplay standpoint. You don't need to use every idea for a level in one level, especially when that's not an endgame level.

The coin-collecting thing could definitely be toned down. I also think it'd be better if the game told you about it at a more reasonable time. Either inform the player at the very start so they can decide whether or not to try it, or tell them after the midpoint so they don't feel conflicted about going after missed coins. The secret exit area was overall confusing and unnecessary. What was the point?

Finally, the Big Mario Discrimination really comes out of nowhere. I understand you could probably just slide under it, but it adds nothing to the gameplay. Just make the passage bigger.
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Sebby19
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Sebby19 » 5 years ago

It was really interesting for the midpoint respawn to be above the canopy.

I'm not sure why raocow felt he didn't have to collect the blue coins. It wouldn't have hurt to collect them even if they weren't necessary.
And when he did, he unnecessarily jumped backwards a platform when he didn't need to. What?
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby raocow » 5 years ago

My brain kept thinking that branch was going to fall off and I had like one second to act!

I had developed branch-paranoia.
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Mineyl » 5 years ago

Septentrion Pleiades wrote:I don't recall the wizard appearing in other levels either. raocow was being creamed by the wizard despite him being common in hacks.
Thing is, the magikoopa is a sprite that necessitates a lot of waiting around. If you can't jump on it to take it out almost immediately, you have to goad it into firing its magic in a safe manner so that you can try to jump on it before it disappears. Problem is, in a level with small, infrequent platforms, the magikoopa will often appear in such a manner that it constantly screws with your jumps. The safe route is to make spin-jumps in hopes of landing on the magical projectile in order to stay safe, but spin jumps aren't always a safe bet when trying to clear larger pits.

When you combine that into the hurried-up nature of the level (p-switch runs), bottomless pits, munchers, and the non-linear nature of the platforms, it's a recipe for very frequent player death. In the words of Egoraptor: "there's too much shit. WAYYYY too much shit."
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Alice » 5 years ago

Sebby19 wrote:I'm not sure why raocow felt he didn't have to collect the blue coins. It wouldn't have hurt to collect them even if they weren't necessary.
That's not really surprising though is it? In a situation like that raocow tends to have a habit of choosing the worst option fairly consistently.

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Willhart
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Willhart » 5 years ago

That level has a nice theme and song. It looks mostly well designed too.

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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Shard1697 » 5 years ago

I'll agree with the video that the lack of powerups in the first half was weird, but besides that it seems pretty together and I have a weakness for latitu stages, I love those guys. Although I think they're a bit easier if you jump on them whenever it looks like you have an opening, because even though they come back that gives you a bit of time to breath each time you do it and makes the waves of spinies more managable.

The level clear music was truly exceptional

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Mineyl
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Mineyl » 5 years ago

Spinies can be slide-killed in SMW, for future reference. :) I used to never risk it, either, because you can't do it in SMB3.
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby spitznagl » 5 years ago

Actually there were two mushrooms before the midpoint, both in blocks that raocow didn't check.

Good level. Maybe not the most creative, but it's a fun type of difficulty imo.
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby MonkeyShrapnel » 5 years ago

spitznagl wrote:Actually there were two mushrooms before the midpoint, both in blocks that raocow didn't check.

Good level. Maybe not the most creative, but it's a fun type of difficulty imo.
I was gonna complain that it seemed like the power-ups were weirdly placed but if that's the case then it's just a classic case of raocow hitting all the wrong blocks.

This level felt weird to me though, I like the vibes it gives off and it feels like it encourages rushing which is always fun but at the same time, it has lots of places to get stuck in, I'm not really sure what to think.
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Re: A Second Mario Thing: but I just can't

Postby Dragon Fogel » 5 years ago

If those powerups were somewhere in the masses of blocks with nothing whatsoever making them stand out, that's still a design flaw. Especially since that suggests they were in the more inconvenient blocks to check.

An inconvenient lone block is one thing, but an inconvenient block in a cluster of blocks is asking to be ignored. At the least, it should stand out in some way.

This isn't a case of "raocow just didn't check every single block", it's "he checked all the convenient blocks and there weren't any powerups in them so he didn't bother checking the inconvenient ones".
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