raocow's talkhaus

I'm so glad that this project isn't dead :D I'm not so great at making levels but i can give it a go if you're looking for some World 1 type easy style levels. Or levels that basically have 1 of everything in, a comprehensive level from which you can see all of the basic physics of SMW (I think that could help but what do you guys think?)

Basic levels will be fine. I can do basic levels to show off the physics, but aesthetics aren't really my thing. I can make levels that work, but they may not look very interesting.

Small update on some of my thoughts right now. I'm going through Game Maker help files and looking at all the scripting commands, trying to learn and get the hang of everything, and I found something kinda interesting. They have commands that, if used properly, could be used to make a tiled map editor.

What this means is I can make a possible editor within GM as well as the engine. A tiled map editor is simply a way to place tiles to create rooms. The rooms can be used as levels or maps.

I'm still working on the basic engine and learning the scripting commands and whatnot, but it is possible that I can make the entire Radish engine within Game Maker and since Game Maker allows publishing the game in several formats (depending on which edition you use), I can have it as EXE, iPhone, Android, HTML5, etc. I don't know all the formats, but I can probably cover a large range of OS at the very least.

I definitely like the idea of having support for multiple platforms (and even the HTML5 thing - much potential there), but I think it's a given that things like the editor would have to be a desktop thing (unless you could do something fancy to save levels built in the HTML5 editor to the player's computer).

But I see why Game Maker would be a good choice for working on this, and I would definitely love to take Radish Engine games with me on my phone as well as on my PC. :)

I can't promise too much for now. Still need to get the basic engine down. I think once I start figuring everything out, all the pieces will just fall together and I'll be able to get out a small demo of progress made.

From what I've seen, everything will be fairly easy once I learn to script in GM. I once thought that Thwomps would be difficult due to making them return to their original position after attacking, but even that seems to be covered.

For the sake of simplicity, I'll just be using EXE for any demos while working on basic engine and sort of demo starter game. Once the engine is finished, I can try to release it in other formats, then just repeat the process with the editor (if it really is possible and I'm not mistaken) and try combining the two together to play test the levels, which I'm assuming would require saving the level and loading it into the engine.

warioeagle wrote:For the sake of simplicity, I'll just be using EXE for any demos while working on basic engine and sort of demo starter game. Once the engine is finished, I can try to release it in other formats, then just repeat the process with the editor (if it really is possible and I'm not mistaken) and try combining the two together to play test the levels, which I'm assuming would require saving the level and loading it into the engine.

Of course! Best to get most of the content done before you start thinking about other platforms - and worry about the platform-specific tweaks when most of the programming is done. Good to see this is still being figured out :)

I got a pretty good idea already. I do have a sample platforming engine to look at and I have the help files to see what all the commands mean.

I do think that animating a spring correctly will still be difficult though, so I may just have jump blocks. I did mention this problem before and my solution is similar to the Zephyr's in DT with just having it spring you up without an animation. I was thinking of having arrow blocks though, just to leave the possibility of them not always facing up.

(Warning: Lots of text below. I try to explain some thoughts/ideas)

Just thought I'd post some recent thoughts I've had for near future stuff to get some opinions on them.

First of all since there will be no small demo (unless it's a future power up), I'm thinking of making an HP system starting at 3. Possibly upgrade-able through collecting upgrades (heart container type things), which could also mean some kind NPCs willing to hand them over for a small fee. All normal powerups and official midpoints will heal, optional bought midpoints is up for debate though.

Secondly, flying powerup. I'm not going to even attempt to add a feather/leaf. They really are too game breaking and overpowered. Instead, I have a couple replacement ideas. One being a glide/float ability with no attacking power, so the cape/leaf without flight or spinning to damage enemies. My other idea is a p-balloon type power. Constantly floating upwards, making downward movement slower and sideways movement is about normal walking speed.

Last thought for now is more about kill chain life gaining. I'm thinking I might keep it for jumping on enemies, but not sure if I should also have it for sliding into them, like I think GBA SMW does. It could make for neat life farming areas other than using stars/leeks and the "dishwasher" trick (shell in one wide two high water).

I do have more ideas, such as two different store types, but those are still too far off to focus on for now. Health system, powerups, and kill chains will come sooner.

I kinda like the feather without attack power, is there anything to replace the side attack power? Maybe a crash bandicoot style spin attack?

What do you mean the side attack?

'Side attack' meaning spinning attack such as the raccoon tail or the cape have (or such as Crash Bandicoot has, as was just previously mentioned). Presumably as its own ability/power-up separate from the designated flying power-up.

Maybe I'll think of something. There will already be some over powered power ups though, like a hammer suit. I'll consider replacing the side attack thing.

Since it's been over a month without an update, I thought I'd give one. I currently have a very basic engine. Basically, I can move and jump. All just solid speeds, no real momentum yet. Since I don't want to be stuck just fine tuning that since I've been working on it off and on for a while, I'm going to start work on some other things, like some simpler enemies. Goombas and Koopas don't really need momentum, so they're practically done as well. Just need to make them walk and fall on their own and turn around for some Koopas.

Here's something for you guys to think about/help me decide on. We all know how broken the SMW spin jump is and how different the game can be without it. Here's the question for you guys: keep the broken spin jump (smaller jump, but immune to landing on many things), make it less broken (remove some immunity), or replace it completely with a drill jump (Mario's butt stomp of current games/Marissa World style drill jump)?

I'll be working on some enemies for now and maybe a little bit on projectiles as well. Just wanted to get everyone's opinion on how spin jump should be handled.

I like the Marisa world style drill drop the best of these ideas.

Hi! I really love this as a whole, but I'd like to express some concerns.
1) I might be wrong, but it may be safest to focus on recreating SMBX for now, and once that is accomplished add the various new (and mostly GREAT) ideas. I say this because replicating SMBX is a set thing, whereas all these ideas could overwhelm a guy, I think? Basically, for the sake of sanity it might be good to stick to the concrete that is SMBX. It would also give you an opportunity to easily have 2 versions: the vanilla SMBX type version and the WOAH CRAZY CHANGES version.
2) I like the ideas of all these background powerups, but I think that wouldn't go over well with a lot of people (I was uneasy about spin jump being a powerup, but at this point I'm fairly comfortable with it. I can't imagine it'd go over well with a fair amount of people though). I'd like to suggest a Knytt Stories-ish powerup list, and a level designer can decide to automatically give the player some or all of the passive powerups for the duration of the level. So, say, the player is shown a short scene upon entering the level, like the black screen with the level title in Yoshi's Island, but instead of the level title it shows the passive powers that are in the level for the whole time.
3) As someone around the middle of the thread mentioned, I agree that focus should be on the engine before it is on the graphics.
4) Video updates or consistent updates of any form would be greatly appreciated by most, I would think. I can't speak for everyone but when a project I'm following updates 1 time in 6 months I get pretty uneasy about the status of the project! That said, that situation doesn't apply so hard to this project, so it's more of a "please don't end up doing this" suggestion.
Finally, I'd just like to say that I really like this project, and though I can't really help in its creation I'd still like to say: good luck! I really hope this doesn't get abandoned like so many project do.


Also in response to the spin jump question, I'd say keep the original spin jump.

e: I'm confused, are you going to be making it in Java still but paralleling in GM, or are you making it all in GM now?
e2!:
5) if you're going to do the overworld cash shop dragon coins deal, might I suggest selling items that are exclusively useful in doing permanent things? You mentioned health system, which I personally like, so there could be as you said sold health boosts, but possibly go further as to have things like "give me x dragon coins, and this path to a new set of levels opens up!", and other unlock type things. This may have been the intention anyways, but I couldn't really tell too well.

sschol wrote:e: I'm confused, are you going to be making it in Java still but paralleling in GM, or are you making it all in GM now?

Currently, it's all in GM now. Once it's all done as far as everything working (at least the basic remake and a few new ideas), I'll port it to Java since Java is fairly easy to mod. The point of this is to remake SMBX, but with SMW physics and Lunar Magic (or better) modding abilities. Also in the end, I want the default given version to be completely clean, no copyright stuff.

sschol wrote:e2!:
5) if you're going to do the overworld cash shop dragon coins deal, might I suggest selling items that are exclusively useful in doing permanent things? You mentioned health system, which I personally like, so there could be as you said sold health boosts, but possibly go further as to have things like "give me x dragon coins, and this path to a new set of levels opens up!", and other unlock type things. This may have been the intention anyways, but I couldn't really tell too well.

I plan to do two shop type things. One being a normal coin store. You can buy powerups (mushroom, fire flower, etc), 1-ups, and other useful but common stuff.
Second will be dragon coins unlocking paths as seen in NSMB DS version. I may also make health upgrades be in this store, but I also think having them for castle rewards or hidden in levels would be cool too. Hiding them in levels would make you have to search for them if you cared to have them (like heart pieces in Zelda)

As far as spin jump being a power up, I don't think it's going to happen. However, I will make the ability something that can be toggled, meaning levels could disable it or to be really complex it can be turned off and on throughout the level via a switch or an 'in this area only' sort of thing.

warioeagle wrote:As far as spin jump being a power up, I don't think it's going to happen. However, I will make the ability something that can be toggled, meaning levels could disable it or to be really complex it can be turned off and on throughout the level via a switch or an 'in this area only' sort of thing.

What about making it an unlockable ability through your dragon coin store?

Onyx3173 wrote:What about making it an unlockable ability through your dragon coin store?

This may be a good idea. If I do this however, I'll have techinally two versions of the spin jump. One, and default, will be a less powerful spin jump. The second one, from the store, would be the broken SMW spin jump. It's just an idea though. I just don't really want to have the broken spin jump right off the bat as it'll make certain challenges harder if you can't spin jump on everything.

warioeagle wrote:

Onyx3173 wrote:What about making it an unlockable ability through your dragon coin store?

This may be a good idea. If I do this however, I'll have techinally two versions of the spin jump. One, and default, will be a less powerful spin jump. The second one, from the store, would be the broken SMW spin jump. It's just an idea though. I just don't really want to have the broken spin jump right off the bat as it'll make certain challenges harder if you can't spin jump on everything.

I like that idea. I know it would probably be too much of pain in the ass to code/graphic, but it would also be neato if upgrades like that made a small, permanent change to Demo's sprites. Like, in the case of the spin jump thing, she's normally barefoot, but after getting the upgrade has a little pair of wooden clogs or something. It'd also be a useful visual cue to see if a level disables the upgraded spinjump or anything like that.

As I said though, pain in the ass. It either requires two (or more) versions of all of Demo's sprites including powerups, or overlaying the sprite of the shoes and such on top, which requires that every sprite share the same feet positions and size. Plus, in my case, just getting tiny details like that looking good as sprites has always been a problem.

Eathanu wrote:I like that idea. I know it would probably be too much of pain in the ass to code/graphic, but it would also be neato if upgrades like that made a small, permanent change to Demo's sprites. Like, in the case of the spin jump thing, she's normally barefoot, but after getting the upgrade has a little pair of wooden clogs or something. It'd also be a useful visual cue to see if a level disables the upgraded spinjump or anything like that.

As I said though, pain in the ass. It either requires two (or more) versions of all of Demo's sprites including powerups, or overlaying the sprite of the shoes and such on top, which requires that every sprite share the same feet positions and size. Plus, in my case, just getting tiny details like that looking good as sprites has always been a problem.

This wouldn't be very hard to code, actually. It'll be a little annoying though. Every code for animation changes will need to check if the upgrade is gotten and enabled per stage, then change to the clog sprites instead of normal sprites. This may be harder for the spriter though since they'd have to add it to every sprite Demo has.

If I do make upgrades like that, it'll probably be a change in the HUD or something simpler than changing sprites for visual cues.

I was inspired to join up partly due to this thread. The SMBX engine is definitely worthy of continuation, and a copyright-clean version is even better.

Given that you've switched development to Game Maker, have you gotten a chance to look at Martin Piecyk's platform engine? It's rather old (last updated 2007) but is easily the most comprehensive starting point I've seen on the web, and is the basis for my own pet project. It handles most of the workhorse stuff you need to start right out of the box, and could be expanded to include everything else needed, from physics tweaking to the power ups.

Cadwyn wrote:I was inspired to join up partly due to this thread. The SMBX engine is definitely worthy of continuation, and a copyright-clean version is even better.

Given that you've switched development to Game Maker, have you gotten a chance to look at Martin Piecyk's platform engine? It's rather old (last updated 2007) but is easily the most comprehensive starting point I've seen on the web, and is the basis for my own pet project. It handles most of the workhorse stuff you need to start right out of the box, and could be expanded to include everything else needed, from physics tweaking to the power ups.

Thanks for that. I've taken a look and it's something I think I'll be using. I may need to tweak a few things, but that seems to have everything I'd need to start. I still have plenty of work to do with all the ideas I have and what's not included in that engine, but that will be a major help.

Just giving a bump to show the changed first post to include a brief summary of this project as well as to list what I'm doing. The list is a way for you guys to see my progress, as long as I remember to update it, as well as a way for me to keep track of all the ideas I've had myself or have been given with suggestions. I'm almost positive I've forgotten something on the list, but I'll add it later when I remember what else there is.

Okay, big find from the GMC front. So looking for an alternative to Piecyk's engine, I stumbled upon what may be even more promising: the Hello Engine. I'll try it out tonight after work, but I think it'll be your best bet. I really can't think of a reason NOT to use this, especially since the developer has said he won't be adding more features, and the extra features is what really distinguishes SMBX in the first place.

That said it's designed for the Pro version of GM, but really that's what you should be using if you use Game Maker in the first place. I'll do what I can to contribute from here on out, probably level building at the very least.

I just watch the video and that engine looks amazing. I'll have to edit very little if I use that and Yoshi will be a thing in Radish after all. I'll only need to edit/add a few things, such as stores and coins not resetting to 0 for a life. That actually looks very much like SMBX with added features. I'll take a look at the code and see if it's as easy to follow as the other engine you linked.

Edit: I was able to open this and look around at some stuff. It does seem fairly simple to follow along with the code. Unfortunately, I don't have GM Pro yet, so I don't want to edit anything in case it breaks the engine. I'll try to get GM Pro as soon as I can and start working on this. Until then, I'll work on a few things that aren't in that engine, such as the stores.

Edit 2: I'll be getting GM Pro in about 2 weeks, so I may release a demo after that. I'll need to replace sprites and possibly make a few edits, but I'll release something after I finish that.