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Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: NO ITEMS, FINAL DES--PRESENTATION!

do you like them video games? what about those there romhacks? well pop on in here and talk about them then! what are you waiting for?!
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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby TheFinalSentinel » 5 years ago

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby HamsterZerg » 5 years ago

TheFinalSentinel wrote:Image
And yet Bowser and Ganondorf got in as early as Melee...

Blake is a flippin' idiot. At least the "He's too big." argument has some basis.
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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby bkamakaze » 5 years ago

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Menshay » 5 years ago

Bowser and Ganondorf are kings. They ARE the law.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Ometeotl » 5 years ago

Doctor Shemp wrote:Also having so many Fire Emblem characters is odd for a series with an extremely small fandom outside of Japan and, really, a pretty small one in Japan as well. Why does a series that's only gone platinum once have four characters, more than much better-known series like Metroid & Star Fox?
By that logic, there should be 25 Mario characters, 13 Pokemon and one of every other series.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Leet » 5 years ago

Doctor Shemp wrote:Also having so many Fire Emblem characters is odd for a series with an extremely small fandom outside of Japan and, really, a pretty small one in Japan as well. Why does a series that's only gone platinum once have four characters, more than much better-known series like Metroid & Star Fox?
Because a) the games aren't made based on American audiences and b) Fire Emblem has been around since the NES days and is a staple of Nintendo, and c) it still exists and gets new games released today, unlike Star Fox and Metroid.

Awakening had amazing sales compared to other recent games in the series and I think Nintendo is very happy about that. So they are glad to promote it even more.

Also because popularity is not the only thing in the world l o l
FluffiMasta wrote:I think the problem with Metroid characters is that there... really isn't anyone who could fit as a fighter except Samus/Zero Suit Samus.
Fusion Suit Samus :P

and Adam Malkovich

In all seriousness, I really, really do wish there were more Metroid characters for Smash, but the nature of the games is usually to have Samus independently take down powerful monsters so yeah, it just doesn't lend itself well...
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Leet wrote:Also because popularity is not the only thing in the world l o l
If you're making a mascot fighter, the idea is that they're mascots, i.e. well known.

I'm not saying that there should be no Fire Emblem characters, just that 4 is excessive, especially when there are more popular series with fewer fighters. It's fine to want to represent and push a smaller series, but at 4 characters, that's a lot of space for that.

Ok, Metroid was a bad example, but what about Donkey Kong? Dixie, Cranky & Funky are all individually more well-known than Fire Emblem characters, and Dixie & Cranky have relatively established movesets: Dixie from the older DKC games, and Cranky from Tropical Freeze. Or they could have brought Mewtwo back like a lot of people want, or Squirtle (who's fairly popular based on his anime depiction) or Ivysaur (not really that big at all actually). Even Waluigi or Birdo are bigger.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Ometeotl » 5 years ago

Doctor Shemp wrote:
Leet wrote:Also because popularity is not the only thing in the world l o l
If you're making a mascot fighter, the idea is that they're mascots, i.e. well known.

I'm not saying that there should be no Fire Emblem characters, just that 4 is excessive, especially when there are more popular series with fewer fighters. It's fine to want to represent and push a smaller series, but at 4 characters, that's a lot of space for that.

Ok, Metroid was a bad example, but what about Donkey Kong? Dixie, Cranky & Funky are all individually more well-known than Fire Emblem characters, and Dixie & Cranky have relatively established movesets: Dixie from the older DKC games, and Cranky from Tropical Freeze. Or they could have brought Mewtwo back like a lot of people want, or Squirtle (who's fairly popular based on his anime depiction) or Ivysaur (not really that big at all actually). Even Waluigi or Birdo are bigger.
Ometeotl wrote:By that logic, there should be 25 Mario characters, 13 Pokemon and one of every other series.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Leet » 5 years ago

smash has shown repeatedly to not care too much about what's well-known. sure it gives lots of content to popular things like mario and pokemon, but who the hell knew about Ice Climbers before Smash? why ROB? why Mr. Game and Watch?

its still very unfortunately skewed towards the big two, but relevance has still been, well, frequently irrelevant.

anyway my main point of the post was that fire emblem was popular and important enough to include at least 4 characters when mario has like 11
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Leet wrote:smash has shown repeatedly to not care too much about what's well-known. sure it gives lots of content to popular things like mario and pokemon, but who the hell knew about Ice Climbers before Smash? why ROB? why Mr. Game and Watch?

its still very unfortunately skewed towards the big two, but relevance has still been, well, frequently irrelevant.

anyway my main point of the post was that fire emblem was popular and important enough to include at least 4 characters when mario has like 11
7 actually. Yes, Ice Climber was a pretty small game, but that's why it only had one character, and not even that anymore. ROB & Game & Watch were huge in their time though (well, ROB not so much, but still big) but again, just one character. So yes, Fire Emblem has fewer characters than Mario, as it should, but it also has over twice as many as many Nintendo franchises that are significantly bigger: Animal Crossing, Donkey Kong, F-Zero, Metroid, Punch-Out, Star Fox, Wario, Wii & Yoshi. Now obviously quite a few of those are constrained in possible fighter choices, but there's quite a few that aren't as well.

When all the other lesser-known series get one character and fairly well-known series get two, giving Fire Emblem four seems like "we're going to push the hell out of this series until you like it".
Ometeotl wrote:By that logic, there should be 25 Mario characters, 13 Pokemon and one of every other series.
Not at all, there should and is a cap on those series so that it doesn't end up being a Mario fighter + guests.

My point is that it's clear someone is playing favourites very heavily, and I wonder who it is, as proportionally Fire Emblem should only have a single character, or two at the max.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Leet » 5 years ago

Doctor Shemp wrote:
Leet wrote:smash has shown repeatedly to not care too much about what's well-known. sure it gives lots of content to popular things like mario and pokemon, but who the hell knew about Ice Climbers before Smash? why ROB? why Mr. Game and Watch?

its still very unfortunately skewed towards the big two, but relevance has still been, well, frequently irrelevant.

anyway my main point of the post was that fire emblem was popular and important enough to include at least 4 characters when mario has like 11
7 actually.
mario, luigi, bowser, peach, dr. mario, bowser jr., rosalina, wario, yoshi, donkey kong and diddy kong

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Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Yoshi's pretty much doing his own thing, so I'd count him as a separate series, but he does sometimes show up in the same games. DK though hasn't shown up in the same game as Mario since Donkey Kong Jr, except that one Mario vs DK game. It's a separate series now.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Jesuiscontent » 5 years ago

You're really underestimating fire emblem's popularity I think shemp. Japan especially has always been very fond of JRPG characters (just see in the previous poll or whatever how robin is #1 newcomer) and fire emblem is certainly more popular over there than star fox or freaking punch-out (did you want them to put glass joe in the game or what), but more importantly nintendo knows more than any of us what has potential, and with the lastest FE being (sadly) focused around waifuism all over the place, it's no wonder it's going to appeal to a lot of people (especially in Japan)
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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Leet » 5 years ago

Doctor Shemp wrote:Yoshi's pretty much doing his own thing, so I'd count him as a separate series, but he does sometimes show up in the same games. DK though hasn't shown up in the same game as Mario since Donkey Kong Jr, except that one Mario vs DK game. It's a separate series now.
Yoshi isn't "doing his own thing" at all, any Yoshi's Island-based games without Mario in them are few and far between, and anyway, who the hell doesn't associate Yoshi with Mario? Same thing with Wario who's name and (one of his) appearance(s) is a direct reference to Mario.

"DK though hasn't shown up in the same game as Mario since Donkey Kong Jr, except that one Mario vs DK game."

As for Donkey Kong, DK characters still show up in all the sports and parties and hitball titles, so I'm not sure where you're getting that from. In addition, your quote can be paraphrased thusly -

"DK hasn't shown up in the same game as Mario since Donkey Kong Jr, except when he did."
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Jesuiscontent wrote:Possibly, but I'm going on sales data, and really the only one that did alright was the new one and maybe the GBA one. Even in Japan the old ones didn't do well, even by standards of the time. And, although it's a broader problem than Smash Bros, Nintendo should realise that Japan isn't the world. Specifically, at last count, it's about 1/4 of the Wii U audience and about 1/3 of the 3DS audience. So while the original Punch-Out wasn't so big in Japan (although still bigger than all but three Fire Emblems) it was big in the US. It's also true that there are things that are popular in Japan - like waifuism, for example, or super-cute anime - that are directly alienating elsewhere. I'm not saying that's a problem in Smash currently, but putting Japan first can exclude everyone else, just as putting the US first - like nearly all FPS games do - excludes Japan.
Leet wrote:As for Donkey Kong, DK characters still show up in all the sports and parties and hitball titles, so I'm not sure where you're getting that from. In addition, your quote can be paraphrased thusly -

"DK hasn't shown up in the same game as Mario since Donkey Kong Jr, except when he did."
Yeah, in a game no-one gave two shits about. And now Link & Villager are soon to be in Mario Kart, so the line's not clear.

It's a spinoff series. Just because the characters originated in another series doesn't change the fact that they now appear mostly by themselves in games that play very differently to the original source. Same with Wario Ware. Would you say Frasier is the same show as Cheers?

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby InsaneIntentions1 » 5 years ago

As much as I really don't care for FE Dark Pit is still the worst character in the game
That crazy voice dude
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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Leet » 5 years ago

I don't know shit about tv but, if you're implying one's the spinoff of another, then I would say that if characters from Cheers and Frasier appeared in a crossover for some reason, they wouldn't get double representation points just because they split. I see the "Yoshi is definitely not a Mario character" argument as an excuse for people to shove more and more Mario crap in a Nintendo crossover game. I hear the trophies in sm4sh 3ds have trophies for blocks and pipes from Mario, while trophies of classic DS games' characters (keep in mind that smash 3ds' trophies are supposed to focus on handheld games like those) such as the Elite Beat Agents and Kyle Hyde have been excised from Brawl's trophy offerings.
And now Link & Villager are soon to be in Mario Kart, so the line's not clear.
crossover dlc, donkey kong has been a mainstay and originated from the mario series anyway
It's a spinoff series. Just because the characters originated in another series doesn't change the fact that they now appear mostly by themselves in games that play very differently to the original source.
by that logic would you say that Dr. Mario is definitely not a mario character whatsoever and that he is a Dr. Mario character? :/
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby pholtos » 5 years ago

So I need to know.... what kind of logic did they decide on by adding dark pit?
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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Leet » 5 years ago

theres nothing wrong with dark pit

if they didnt add dark pit, you know what you'd have? the exact same game but without dark pit
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby InsaneIntentions1 » 5 years ago

To spite everyone who wanted Ridley
That crazy voice dude
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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Ometeotl » 5 years ago

pholtos wrote:So I need to know.... what kind of logic did they decide on by adding dark pit?
"We're running out of time, but we should have enough time for a quick clone character. Let's take Dark Pit and make him a character instead of just an alt, since he has unique voice clips and all."

Pretty much what Sakurai confirmed to allow Lucina to be a character.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Leet wrote:by that logic would you say that Dr. Mario is definitely not a mario character whatsoever and that he is a Dr. Mario character? :/
Yes. If anything the line's even clearer in that case since the only time Dr. Mario & Mario have appeared together is in Smash Bros. He's still a waste of character since he's a clone though.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Leet » 5 years ago

Calling Dr. Mario a waste of a character implies that making a non-clone would take just as much time and effort.

If Dr. Mario wasn't in Smash Bros., the game would be exactly the same except without Dr. Mario.

It's not like not making a quick "clone" removes any potential other characters.
Well it is a decent hack but sometime its just too repetitif there no level that actually pop in your face and your like oh yeah that level they all ressemble themselves and just monster along the way.
Blood Ghoul wrote:Sometimes it seems my blood spurts out in gobs, as if it were a fountain's pulsing sobs. I clearly hear it mutter as it goes yet cannot find the wound from which it flows. Before I met you, baby, I didn't know what I was missing.

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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby TheFinalSentinel » 5 years ago

You know, I love the way people call characters clones just based on their specials being superficially similar...
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Re: Smash Bros. 3DS/Wii U: WARNING! NEW THREAD APPROACHING!

Postby Doctor Shemp » 5 years ago

Leet wrote:Calling Dr. Mario a waste of a character implies that making a non-clone would take just as much time and effort.

If Dr. Mario wasn't in Smash Bros., the game would be exactly the same except without Dr. Mario.

It's not like not making a quick "clone" removes any potential other characters.
They could have cloned characters that aren't as well represented - Samus cloned as Dark Samus for instance - or made a clone with more significant mechanical changes, like Metal Mario.


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