romhack shack 改 (discord on OP, but don't abandon the thread!!!)

[KobaBeach]

i dont know what you want me to do about it. people play mario for levels

reply 100 get

[TiKi]

people play mario for levels

huh, am i a rarity? i think a good mario game needs both good levels and bosses. though i guess my mistake is expecting hobbyist projects to be beholden to "high quality game design"

though admittedly it's not like nintendo's been real winners in the 2d mario boss department lately, there's definitely a void that needs to be filled by fan works

[KobaBeach]

though i guess my mistake is expecting hobbyist projects to be beholden to "high quality game design"
(...)
there's definitely a void that needs to be filled by fan works

which is it bro

people aren't gonna make bosses for you with specifications designed exclusively with you in mind
stop being entitled and make your own

i'm fresh off a six hour session of half of hoshigami's first chapter, with fast forwards, and i dont really want to get into a "mario hacks have to have bosses and they have to be better than sex" discussion

if you want to see bosses in mario then make your own. that's how the world is

[TiKi]

i'd say that you having played a bad game and it putting you in a bad mood isn't my fault... ...but i guess the same applies for me thinking that just because i'm (diagnosed/medicated) depressed and want something entertaining that i should get it because it's no one else's fault there either, doesn't it. so... sorry. i guess now we hug it out?

[KobaBeach]

i guess the same applies for me thinking that just because i'm (diagnosed/medicated) depressed and want something entertaining that i should get it because it's no one else's fault there either, doesn't it. so... sorry. i guess now we hug it out?

thank you for understanding

[TiKi]

does anyone recognize this hack

[TiKi]

are we allowed to talk about the process of romhacking in regards to its accessibility?

[KobaBeach]

Unlike certain, Valentine-like "humans" I actually LIKE SMWCP2 so far. #owned

I made it to Velocity Valves and I just played a bunch of other shit instead like Torneko Mystery Dungeon 1 and Star Ocean Blue Sphere and Lunar Sanposuru Gakuen. oops. Rakugaki is also pretty great, but MARIO MUSICAL is too hard for me lmao, had to use savestates, need to do the secret exit. Heraga said he feels like he should have made more references to stuff in the level names like a real Japanese hack. I propose Mario Musical be named "天変地異の詩" (Song of the Angels Natural Disaster) or "草原の檻歌" (Cagesong of the Ocean Meadow) in this bizarro world

[TiKi]

would a pc source port like SM64 do cool stuff for the SMW modding scene, or is the game too attached to old graphics and sound formats? I think having to use assembly vs. say, C++ or Lua is a big barrier to people learning how to make more unique-playing hacks.

[LethalBrownies]

Can someone tell me the mastermind behind the yoshi egg boss in castle 2 in asmt? It's such a pain in the ass I can't help but be impressed. I know crushawake made the level but I don't know if he made the boss as well!

[KobaBeach]

probably crush awaeke

[LethalBrownies]

Okay so Argumentable is an evil genius. 'A Honeypot Trap' is one of the most frustrating non-kaizo levels I have ever played in my life.

[KobaBeach]

yeah it's garbage

[LethalBrownies]

yeah it's garbage

I don't usually like describing levels like that but after the experience I just had I think it's somewhat accurate. Still, it's well made to be frustrating. But garbage properly lays out my feelings towards it right now.

[TiKi]

would a pc source port like SM64 do cool stuff for the SMW modding scene, or is the game too attached to old graphics and sound formats? I think having to use assembly vs. say, C++ or Lua is a big barrier to people learning how to make more unique-playing hacks.

Uh... was this a bad idea?

[KobaBeach]

i do not see the point of porting smw over to pc nor do i know if it's possible

[KobaBeach]

also i believe you can code in C without having it be the PC version of SM64, so

[TiKi]

also i believe you can code in C without having it be the PC version of SM64, so

i meant being able to code in C/C++ for smw, i've been tinkering/contributing to the C++ (con)version of SMBX (thextech) and i find it so much more eminently readable than smw's assembly in terms of structure, variable names, etc., and that's with the smbx creator's code being bad/inefficient in places

[KobaBeach]

i feel like that depends on someone making a recompilation in c for smw i think??? im not 100% sure

im not doing it myself its too much. and trying to make my own lunar magic was already too much

[PSI Ninja]

A few months ago, I was curious whether or not someone was working towards a decompilation of the SMW source code to a high-level language like C. When I looked it up on the Central, this was the closest thing I could find, but unfortunately it seems to be an abandoned effort: https://www.smwcentral.net/?p=viewthread&t=78013

On one hand, it's pretty surprising that a full decompilation for SMW doesn't exist yet. Since N64 games like Super Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time have C decompilations, you'd think that a previous generation game like SMW should already have one. But on the other hand, I think the reason why there isn't a decompilation yet is that a lot of the tools and patches used in SMW hacking were built with ASM coding in mind. It would take a huge effort to have to convert all of those to work with C, when the staff already has plenty of work dealing with moderation of newer submissions, as well as remoderation of older submissions for efficiency and compatibility. So it could be a matter of attitude or hacking culture that prevents a decompilation of SMW from happening.

Regarding ASM, I prefer to learn by example, so my main issue here is that a lot of the available patches and sprite code just aren't documented or commented well enough for a learner to understand easily. Furthermore, ASM authors employ a lot of tricks and shortcuts to write efficient code, which is fair, because you want the game to run as smoothly as possible. But from my point of view, these tricks sort of obfuscate the code, making it harder for an aspiring ASMer to disentangle. As a result, it leads to a lot of tinkering and experimentation on my part to try to figure out how to get things to work, coming from someone who's coding a lot of ASM gimmicks for AAT. But I guess that's meant to be part of the experience of ROM hacking.

Another problem I have is that, even after about a year of writing increasingly complex ASM, I still don't think I have a handle on how SMW "works". There are plenty of tutorials on how to learn ASM, code sprites, etc., but I feel like it's all taught in a vacuum. I have yet to understand how all of the different components of the game connect together. For example, what is the programmatic flow between sprite code, block code, and UberASM? What triggers going from the overworld to the levels proper (something to do with changing game modes?). I haven't been able to find a document that gives the high-level view of how SMW works.

[KobaBeach]

Another problem I have is that, even after about a year of writing increasingly complex ASM, I still don't think I have a handle on how SMW "works". There are plenty of tutorials on how to learn ASM, code sprites, etc., but I feel like it's all taught in a vacuum. I have yet to understand how all of the different components of the game connect together. For example, what is the programmatic flow between sprite code, block code, and UberASM? What triggers going from the overworld to the levels proper (something to do with changing game modes?). I haven't been able to find a document that gives the high-level view of how SMW works.

holy shit bro preach

[Argumentable]

yeah it's garbage

I don't usually like describing levels like that but after the experience I just had I think it's somewhat accurate. Still, it's well made to be frustrating. But garbage properly lays out my feelings towards it right now.

It's fine until isn't. Garbage is accurate - the bees shoudl've been stompable