Episode 2 Discussion Thread

[Mabel]

A desirable feature is having the music code toggle globally. Instead of manually typing in music each time you enter a place, have a flag you can set so that the music information will automatically show whenever the music track changes if the flag is enabled.

this. in fact we can make it so that we can have a toggle box for this as an unlockable, ofc typing it will still be available at the start but this would add in more unlockables

[SAJewers]

That would just be way too complicated to do, as there's no easy way to check to see if the music changed.

Also, IIRC previous discussion dictated no unlockables like Ep1. Just the raocoin extra characters thingy.

[ztarwuff]

Actually, would people be interested in splitting it up, 5 people taking 1 character each?

To prevent it from feeling like a tutorial, would it not be a good idea to create specific levels for each character? You know, like MAKL Vanilla from Ep 1. I remember how people commented on how my level made an excellent tutorial on how to use Kood.

[SAJewers]

Yeah, that's a good idea.

[Imaynotbehere4long]

Actually, would people be interested in splitting it up, 5 people taking 1 character each?

I actually tried to pre-empt this by making my level a Sheath tutorial (you have to use all aspects of Sheath's play-style to get all eight super leeks) as well as everything else I said about it. Do you think it would work like that as-is, or would I have to add monitors showing players how to get past certain sections?

[Hoeloe]

Actually, would people be interested in splitting it up, 5 people taking 1 character each?

To prevent it from feeling like a tutorial, would it not be a good idea to create specific levels for each character? You know, like MAKL Vanilla from Ep 1. I remember how people commented on how my level made an excellent tutorial on how to use Kood.

There was an idea bandied about a while ago to have an intro level, which starts with Sheath returning from the time travel at the end of episode 1. From there, Sheath would progress through the level and meet up with the other characters. The interesting part was to use LunaLua to do a "character switch" - by which I mean have the characters as NPCs in the level, and essentially "posses" those NPCs, rather than transforming. That could be a really neat way to teach specific mechanics of the characters (off the top of my head, for example, requiring Kood float over a gap to press a switch to allow Sheath through a door).

This old video has an idea of what I'm getting at (obviously would need to be less terrible than this):

[docopoper]

The big problem with the original tutorial was that it was attempting to follow the idea of teaching without text, except that it mostly forgot about the teaching part. Teaching without text only works when you make it obvious what you're supposed to do just from the situation. The fact that the tutorial immediately gives you a mysterious powerup and assumes you know to make a running start makes it pretty much impossible unless you know the mechanics.

Also demonstrating all the characters is easy if you just give them all introductory sections before they meet up. You could even work this into the introductory cutscene. When demo and Iris meet up they could say that they had better go find raocow, which would be followed by a cut to raocow overcoming some simple challenges. Once he completes the challenges he finds Demo and Iris there and they meet up. If we go this route we could even make fun of Kood's "High ranking intergalactic freedom fighter" thing by making his tutorial be on a really grungy spaceship in a plot that takes itself too seriously.

[SAJewers]

Actually, would people be interested in splitting it up, 5 people taking 1 character each?

To prevent it from feeling like a tutorial, would it not be a good idea to create specific levels for each character? You know, like MAKL Vanilla from Ep 1. I remember how people commented on how my level made an excellent tutorial on how to use Kood.

There was an idea bandied about a while ago to have an intro level, which starts with Sheath returning from the time travel at the end of episode 1. From there, Sheath would progress through the level and meet up with the other characters. The interesting part was to use LunaLua to do a "character switch" - by which I mean have the characters as NPCs in the level, and essentially "posses" those NPCs, rather than transforming. That could be a really neat way to teach specific mechanics of the characters (off the top of my head, for example, requiring Kood float over a gap to press a switch to allow Sheath through a door).

This old video has an idea of what I'm getting at (obviously would need to be less terrible than this):

I like this idea.

EDIT: Also, have 5 raocoins in the tutorial, and and it unlock something (pily?) to explain the raocoin store mechanic.

[Imaynotbehere4long]

I like this idea.

EDIT: Also, have 5 raocoins in the tutorial, and and it unlock something (pily?) to explain the raocoin store mechanic.

How would that idea work if my level gets accepted (as my level is meant to be the Auto Start Level, among other things)? Also, you didn't respond to my previous post in this thread.

[SAJewers]

Right now, it probably wouldn't, unfortunately. For a sheath tutorial, I think it's also too long IMO.

[ano0maly]

That would just be way too complicated to do, as there's no easy way to check to see if the music changed.

I think the code could be designed in this way: each time you enter a different room or you load an event/code that plays a music, it reads the music title value and compares it to the one that was running before. There would be a check that would see if the titles are identical, and if it isn't, the new music title would be displayed for a few seconds.

[Hoeloe]

or you load an event/code that plays a music

That is the difficult bit.

On section switch is pretty easy, but this would require special LunaLua hooks.

Having said that, checking the tag every frame would probably not be too expensive, so it might be possible to do it that way.

[SAJewers]

That also wouldn't work if you switched music mid-section. honestly, it's just better to have it pop-up when the player does an action.

[Hoeloe]

That also wouldn't work if you switched music mid-section. honestly, it's just better to have it pop-up when the player does an action.

Checking the tag every frame should, as that would detect any change in the music tags regardless of when it happened.

[SAJewers]

I was referring to ano0manly's suggestion. Regardless, I'm going to keep it to a player action.

EDIT: I am though, willing to change how it's activated. Would something like Up + Start work better?

[Hoeloe]

I was referring to ano0manly's suggestion. Regardless, I'm going to keep it to a player action.

EDIT: I am though, willing to change how it's activated. Would something like Up + Start work better?

Keeping it to a player action is a good idea, as some levels are built with that in mind, but typing "music" is a bit of a chore, so up+start may work better.

[ano0maly]

That also wouldn't work if you switched music mid-section.

I noted that:

each time you enter a different room or you load an event/code that plays a music

I don' think it's necessary to check at every frame though. Maybe every two seconds or so.

[Hoeloe]

I don' think it's necessary to check at every frame though. Maybe every two seconds or so.

Perhaps, though depending on the overhead of reading the ID3 tags it may make almost no difference.

[Wohlstand]

I don' think it's necessary to check at every frame though. Maybe every two seconds or so.

Perhaps, though depending on the overhead of reading the ID3 tags it may make almost no difference.

Be sure that ID3 its MP3's thing. With OGG and FLAC case that naming as "Vorbis Comments"/"Vorbis-Tags", I.e. Meta-tags in common.

[docopoper]

If you're going to change it to up + start (which I guess is up + esc on keyboard), you should probably leave typing music as an option too. The difficulty of typing music is also only a problem for LPers that want to show all music, most players probably won't use it all that often.

[raocow]

rather than up + start, would it be feasable to just show it when you pause the game, or is there worth it keeping it 'secret'

[SAJewers]

It wouldn't, as it's possible someone might want to disable pausing the game in their level.

[WasabiJellyfish]

Are there going to be lives still? Cause honestly they're kinda pointless in smbx haha

[Hoeloe]

Are there going to be lives still? Cause honestly they're kinda pointless in smbx haha

I think it was decided that, because so many levels have been made with lives as rewards, that they'll stay for episode 2, but I can't honestly remember.

[WasabiJellyfish]

Are there going to be lives still? Cause honestly they're kinda pointless in smbx haha

I think it was decided that, because so many levels have been made with lives as rewards, that they'll stay for episode 2, but I can't honestly remember.

If we're gonna use the raocoin stuff, we could change some of the lives to them? But only if the level creators are cool with that. It's a bit late cause of submissions though.